1969 Submariner 5513 movement question

[Egret]

I have a 1969 Rolex Submariner 5513. At my watchmaker to get new seals and when he opened it up I was surprised to see it had a 1570 movement instead of the 1520.

This must have been a replacement movement at some point I am guessing as I thought all 5513 Subs had non COSC movements, whereas the 1570 is COSC.

Did Rolex ever put 1570's in 5513 Subs?

Also does this negatively affect its value even though it has a superior movement?

Thanks

[Dan S]

Sometimes only the bridge has been replaced. Is he certain that it is actually a cal 1570? Either way, it's not ideal from a collector's perspective, and will probably make the watch a little harder to sell if that's your concern, but these old watches have lived a life and are rarely perfect, so it shouldn't affect your enjoyment of the watch.

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Sometimes only the bridge has been replaced. Is he certain that it is actually a cal 1570? Either way, it's not ideal from a collector's perspective, and will probably make the watch a little harder to sell if that's your concern, but these old watches have lived a life and are rarely perfect, so it shouldn't affect your enjoyment of the watch.

Ive seen the same thing done with 1520 and 1530 cals in 5500 airkings, where a 1520 bridge has been used on the super precision 1530.

[Egret]

It doesn't bother me at all since I dint ever intend to sell it...just wondering what the ramifications were from a collector standpoint. It definitely is keeping COSC time specs.

Only thing that I can think happened is that when it went to RSC Dallas 25 years ago they changed the bridge.

[jlovda]

Originally Posted by Egret

It doesn't bother me at all since I dint ever intend to sell it...just wondering what the ramifications were from a collector standpoint. It definitely is keeping COSC time specs.

Only thing that I can think happened is that when it went to RSC Dallas 25 years ago they changed the bridge.

Would Rolex do that?

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by jlovda

Would Rolex do that?

It can be very difficult to reconstruct the history of a watch, even if it has been in one family since purchased. Without documentation, memories fade over time and stories evolve. And even if the watch was sent to RSC in 1998, it was already 30 years old at that time.

[TuRo]

I've seen certified (with SRL no) movts in full set 5513 63-69 watches - Rolex are law unto themselves with calibres !
Calibre is only 15-20% value of late 60s 5513 (dial about 50%) watch so no biggy!

[007Sub]

As some suggested it may just be that the auto bridge plate has been changed. If you upload a photo of the movement showing the balance wheel I'll tell you if its a 1570 or 1520 with the bridge plate. In any case, if the movement is 1570 then it was changed at some point and not likely by Rolex since the 1570 are all numbered and married to the watch mid case at the factory. As the 1520 is not COSC, the baseplate is never numbered.

[Ascari_2]

Easiest way to tell is to look at the balance bridge and match it to one of the four in the attached picture. But, just like the automatic works bridge maybe supplemented from one of the other 15xx series movements, so can the balance bridge. However, depending on which movement this is coming from, this can cause you to have timing issues because of the different balance wheels. In short, but I'm trying to say is that matching the balance bridge to one of those shown below is not absolutely conclusive where the rest of the movement came from. Still, it's a good indication and I would wager I guess that the automatic works assembly is a part that is much more likely to be replaced than the balance bridge.



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[007Sub]

These a nice cheat sheet image showing older (top row) vs newer free sprung (right side) vs annular (left side) balance bridges. The easiest way to tell if a movement is chronometer grade is to see if its mainplate is numbered or not.

[Tools]

It's just as likely that the watch was made that way.

Rolex doesn't expect any owner to be breaking into their watch, so they used parts that fit and that they had at their station.

The plates are the same except for the stampings. It has been known for years that these parts are interchanged, just like case backs.