Bezel Issue with GMT Master (1675)

[BKantor]

Hello,

I am new to the forum and hoping I can find assistance here from those of you who are Rolex experts (versus me who simply just wears one!).

For the last couple of years, the entire bezel assembly has been popping off my watch whenever it lightly catches on something. I am not sure if "Bezel Assembly" is the proper term, but I am referring to the serrated ring with the insert along with the flat "gasket" that sits below it on the watch. At least a dozen times over the two years, this assembly has popped off and I was always lucky enough to find the pieces and pop them back onto the watch . . . until a few months ago! Now the watch is "bezel-less" and looks like the GMT Master Brando wore in Apocalypse Now! While it looked good on him, I don't want my Rolex to be without a bezel!

Last week I was in NYC and made an appointment at the Rolex Service Center (RSC). I was floored when they informed me that I would have to have the watch serviced (for $700) before they would replace the bezel assembly (for an additional $300). No matter that it was serviced just a year ago! What a bunch of nonsense! How they can blackmail a customer into an un-needed and unrelated $700 service that has nothing to do with a bezel is just beyond me. They lost a ton of credibility with me.

My deceased father purchased this watch in 1972 and I have been wearing it since 1991. It has incredible sentimental value and I want to repair it, but there is no way I can stomach $1,000 simply to obtain the bezel. Maybe the next time the watch truly needs a maintenance service, I would be willing to pay the additional cost for the bezel assembly, but I'm not willing to give Rolex a $700 tip just to get the bezel!

I have been looking online for a fix to last me until the time that I need to do a full service again on the watch. I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for me. I did find a non-OEM kit online that I was considering, but was also wondering if there is a way to work with the RSC to get them to replace the bezel without doing an unnecessary and expensive service. Has anyone had any luck working with them on these types of issues?

I would love any productive suggestions that any of you might have.

Bruce

PS. Also, I did view a GMT II video on how to replace the Bezel. The video showed a spring attached to the watch casing. I never saw such a spring on my earlier model GMT. Of course, it is ENTIRELY possible that my watch actually did have this spring and the first time the entire assembly popped off, I did not find the spring and erroneously thought I had found all the parts. Does anyone know if my GMT model #1675 had this spring?

[Tools]

Take it to a Rolex qualified watchmaker.

Most bezels and assemblies can be knurled or adjusted to fit better with the right tools.

Pre 16700/16710 GMT's have a friction lock bezel and do not use the click spring.

[Dan S]

So you had the watch serviced last year but the watchmaker didn't address the bezel problem? There is a special Rolex tool that can be used to make small adjustments to the bezel. Anyway, replacing the bezel itself isn't a big deal, but a period-correct insert will be several thousand USD.

[JustinK]

You can buy genuine parts from a reseller for about $1200. If Rolex is only going to charge you $300 for the bezel assembly with service just do it.

I am not sure if your watch has the original dial and hands but just refuse any other services they offer.

The 1675 does not have a click spring but does have a friction ring. It’s basically a bent piece of metal to apply friction on the bezel from the underside to prevent it from spinning freely.

Your best option in my opinion is to service it with Rolex.

[lee fowler]

Rolex 1006 is your friend I believe!

[springer]

The crystal retaining ring, which is what the bezel snaps on to, is probably worn. When it becomes worn, the bezel itself does not fit as tight as it should and the bezel may pop off when it is struck against a wall or door jam.

There are four parts to the bezel assembly. A couple of these parts can affect whether the bezel is too loose or too tight. These four parts are:

1) crystal retaining ring
2) the flat spring
3) bezel insert
4) bezel ring

If these four parts are not in sync and fit properly, bezels can become too loose causing the bezel to fall off or the bezel might become too tight causing excessive friction on the bezel assembly to the extent that it will not turn properly.

The bezel assembly parts and installation goes as follows:

A) The crystal is fit to the watch
B) Once the crystal is installed, the crystal retaining ring is press fit over the crystal causing a tight seal to prevent water from entering through the crystal. (The bezel snaps on to the crystal retaining ring)
C) The bezel flat spring is then placed over the top of the crystal retaining ring
D) Next, the bezel insert is pressed into the bezel. This can normally be done by pressing the insert into the bezel with your thumbs, or, with plastic tipped pliers, a round pencil or other make-shift tool.
E) Finally, the bezel assembly (the bezel and insert) is press fit onto the crystal retaining ring with your fingers.

My watchmaker here in Dallas, who has been servicing various Rolex models for over 50 years, with 10 years as a technician at the Rolex Service Center in Dallas, told me once while discussing a poorly fit GMT bezel assembly that the biggest problem working on GMTs at the RSC were the bezel assemblies.

He said that the bezels and/or assembly parts caused more grief for the technicians that he cared to say. He said they were always replacing crystal retaining rings or bezels that did not fit properly after a watch was disassembled, serviced and reassembled.

As mentioned in another post, there is a Rolex tool that can be used on the bezel assembly to tighten loose bezels. Also, crystal retaining rings can be "blipped" with a punch on or near the edges in four spots (usually the 12, 3, 6 and 9 positions) which will spread the metal outward on the retaining ring thereby giving the bezel more area to grip on the retaining ring.

One other area that can create problems with the bezel assembly is the flat spring. If a bezel assembly turns very hard, the excess friction could be from the flat spring. One way too check this is to remove the bezel assembly and flat spring - then reinstall the bezel assembly without the flat spring. If the bezel turns much better, the flat spring is causing too much tension and binding. The flat spring needs to have a small amount of metal removed from the outer diameter by turning it on a lathe. This should be done in very small increments. If too much metal is removed from the flat spring, the bezel assembly will turn too freely and the flat spring will need to be replaced.

[swaini3]

Nicely detailed above

[TimeLord2]

I am always amazed at the depth of information available from some of the forum members, and Springer typically takes it to another level. I too had an issue with the bezel, mine was binding. In the end, Phillip Ridley serviced the watch and sourced a period correct bezel too! Very grateful for that!

[donq]

If you look around for a good 1675 bezel and insert, it will probably end up costing you more than $1000.00.

Might be cheaper to get the service from RSC.

[Styles Bitchley]

$1000 isn’t bad for a full service and bezel/service insert. Without seeing your existing one it’s impossible to know what you’ve got, but I’d venture to guess that it’s worth more than you think. Selling it may help subsidize your expense if you’d prefer something new and functional.

[Dan S]

It would be helpful if the OP could clarify whether he still has the bezel and insert and just can't install them, or whether he lost everything entirely. Without knowing that, it's hard to give good advice. What exactly is the current situation?

[Styles Bitchley]

Originally Posted by Dan S

It would be helpful if the OP could clarify whether he still has the bezel and insert and just can't install them, or whether he lost everything entirely. Without knowing that, it's hard to give good advice. What exactly is the current situation?

Oh yeah. I just re-read a bit more closely. Seems like it popped off and he’s lost it.

[Wahlberg]

I think I slightly bent my bezel ring switching inserts. Can a watchmaker easily fix this? Or can I do this myself?

After messing up I pressed it between two books and it got better but now it turns a bit heavier when installed again, not as smooth anymore. I feel like a fool to be honest that this happened. I should have left it alone. I don't think the bezel ring will pop off but what about the insert? It sits fine again but still.

I don't mind sending it to an RSC but the last time I went there they said they would replace my hands (and dial) which I don't want.

Any advice?

[TimeToGo]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

I think I slightly bent my bezel ring switching inserts. Can a watchmaker easily fix this? Or can I do this myself?

After messing up I pressed it between two books and it got better but now it turns a bit heavier when installed again, not as smooth anymore. I feel like a fool to be honest that this happened. I should have left it alone. I don't think the bezel ring will pop off but what about the insert? It sits fine again but still.

I don't mind sending it to an RSC but the last time I went there they said they would replace my hands (and dial) which I don't want.

Any advice?

Bezel or tension ring ?!

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by springer

The crystal retaining ring, which is what the bezel snaps on to, is probably worn. When it becomes worn, the bezel itself does not fit as tight as it should and the bezel may pop off when it is struck against a wall or door jam.

There are four parts to the bezel assembly. A couple of these parts can affect whether the bezel is too loose or too tight. These four parts are:

1) crystal retaining ring
2) the flat spring
3) bezel insert
4) bezel ring

If these four parts are not in sync and fit properly, bezels can become too loose causing the bezel to fall off or the bezel might become too tight causing excessive friction on the bezel assembly to the extent that it will not turn properly.

The bezel assembly parts and installation goes as follows:

A) The crystal is fit to the watch
B) Once the crystal is installed, the crystal retaining ring is press fit over the crystal causing a tight seal to prevent water from entering through the crystal. (The bezel snaps on to the crystal retaining ring)
C) The bezel flat spring is then placed over the top of the crystal retaining ring
D) Next, the bezel insert is pressed into the bezel. This can normally be done by pressing the insert into the bezel with your thumbs, or, with plastic tipped pliers, a round pencil or other make-shift tool.
E) Finally, the bezel assembly (the bezel and insert) is press fit onto the crystal retaining ring with your fingers.

My watchmaker here in Dallas, who has been servicing various Rolex models for over 50 years, with 10 years as a technician at the Rolex Service Center in Dallas, told me once while discussing a poorly fit GMT bezel assembly that the biggest problem working on GMTs at the RSC were the bezel assemblies.

He said that the bezels and/or assembly parts caused more grief for the technicians that he cared to say. He said they were always replacing crystal retaining rings or bezels that did not fit properly after a watch was disassembled, serviced and reassembled.

As mentioned in another post, there is a Rolex tool that can be used on the bezel assembly to tighten loose bezels. Also, crystal retaining rings can be "blipped" with a punch on or near the edges in four spots (usually the 12, 3, 6 and 9 positions) which will spread the metal outward on the retaining ring thereby giving the bezel more area to grip on the retaining ring.

One other area that can create problems with the bezel assembly is the flat spring. If a bezel assembly turns very hard, the excess friction could be from the flat spring. One way too check this is to remove the bezel assembly and flat spring - then reinstall the bezel assembly without the flat spring. If the bezel turns much better, the flat spring is causing too much tension and binding. The flat spring needs to have a small amount of metal removed from the outer diameter by turning it on a lathe. This should be done in very small increments. If too much metal is removed from the flat spring, the bezel assembly will turn too freely and the flat spring will need to be replaced.

Incredible detail JP

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by TimeToGo

Bezel or tension ring ?!

This thing (example pic). I put mine away again. I got a headache from messing up.

[KY..]

Originally Posted by BKantor

For the last couple of years, the entire bezel assembly has been popping off my watch whenever it lightly catches on something. I am not sure if "Bezel Assembly" is the proper term, but I am referring to the serrated ring with the insert along with the flat "gasket" that sits below it on the watch. At least a dozen times over the two years, this assembly has popped off and I was always lucky enough to find the pieces and pop them back onto the watch . . . until a few months ago! Now the watch is "bezel-less" and looks like the GMT Master Brando wore in Apocalypse Now! While it looked good on him, I don't want my Rolex to be without a bezel!

You are stating the entire bezel assembly and insert is now gone from your 1972 GMT Master 1675.
You will have to decide if you want period correct 70’s factory original parts or service parts or aftermarket.
Unfortunately that is an expensive repair if you want to get it back to its original 1972 condition.
It sucks, but I would say $1000 is at the low end of getting Rolex original replacement parts.

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by KY..

You are stating the entire bezel assembly and insert is now gone from your 1972 GMT Master 1675.
You will have to decide if you want period correct 70’s factory original parts or service parts or aftermarket.
Unfortunately that is an expensive repair if you want to get it back to its original 1972 condition.
It sucks, but I would say $1000 is at the low end of getting Rolex original replacement parts.

I think the OP is long gone. He posted that 5 months ago and never followed up here.

[KY..]

Originally Posted by Kingface66

I think the OP is long gone. He posted that 5 months ago and never followed up here.

Missed checking the dates, love it when that happens.

[coffeebreak]

Originally Posted by springer

The crystal retaining ring, which is what the bezel snaps on to, is probably worn. When it becomes worn, the bezel itself does not fit as tight as it should and the bezel may pop off when it is struck against a wall or door jam.

There are four parts to the bezel assembly. A couple of these parts can affect whether the bezel is too loose or too tight. These four parts are:

1) crystal retaining ring
2) the flat spring
3) bezel insert
4) bezel ring

If these four parts are not in sync and fit properly, bezels can become too loose causing the bezel to fall off or the bezel might become too tight causing excessive friction on the bezel assembly to the extent that it will not turn properly.

The bezel assembly parts and installation goes as follows:

A) The crystal is fit to the watch
B) Once the crystal is installed, the crystal retaining ring is press fit over the crystal causing a tight seal to prevent water from entering through the crystal. (The bezel snaps on to the crystal retaining ring)
C) The bezel flat spring is then placed over the top of the crystal retaining ring
D) Next, the bezel insert is pressed into the bezel. This can normally be done by pressing the insert into the bezel with your thumbs, or, with plastic tipped pliers, a round pencil or other make-shift tool.
E) Finally, the bezel assembly (the bezel and insert) is press fit onto the crystal retaining ring with your fingers.

My watchmaker here in Dallas, who has been servicing various Rolex models for over 50 years, with 10 years as a technician at the Rolex Service Center in Dallas, told me once while discussing a poorly fit GMT bezel assembly that the biggest problem working on GMTs at the RSC were the bezel assemblies.

He said that the bezels and/or assembly parts caused more grief for the technicians that he cared to say. He said they were always replacing crystal retaining rings or bezels that did not fit properly after a watch was disassembled, serviced and reassembled.

As mentioned in another post, there is a Rolex tool that can be used on the bezel assembly to tighten loose bezels. Also, crystal retaining rings can be "blipped" with a punch on or near the edges in four spots (usually the 12, 3, 6 and 9 positions) which will spread the metal outward on the retaining ring thereby giving the bezel more area to grip on the retaining ring.

One other area that can create problems with the bezel assembly is the flat spring. If a bezel assembly turns very hard, the excess friction could be from the flat spring. One way too check this is to remove the bezel assembly and flat spring - then reinstall the bezel assembly without the flat spring. If the bezel turns much better, the flat spring is causing too much tension and binding. The flat spring needs to have a small amount of metal removed from the outer diameter by turning it on a lathe. This should be done in very small increments. If too much metal is removed from the flat spring, the bezel assembly will turn too freely and the flat spring will need to be replaced.

Bumping this thread up. Very very useful information here. The knowledge sharing in this forum is quite valuable.

Would replacing the crystal retaining ring solve the problem? Or not necessarily, if the problem is with the bezel and not with the retaining ring?

[Hawkeye98]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

I think I slightly bent my bezel ring switching inserts. Can a watchmaker easily fix this? Or can I do this myself?

Would you mind sharing how you messed up the ring? I'm about to attempt the insert swap and would appreciate any lessons learned. Too much force when separating the bezel from the case? Too much force while pushing out the insert? Hope everything got sorted out for you! Thanks in advance.

[TimeLord2]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye98

Would you mind sharing how you messed up the ring? I'm about to attempt the insert swap and would appreciate any lessons learned. Too much force when separating the bezel from the case? Too much force while pushing out the insert? Hope everything got sorted out for you! Thanks in advance.

Last post on this thread was almost a year ago and Walberg's comment almost 2 years old. I have done this with my 1675/3 several times and it has an 18K or 14K bezel ring. Use a knife to separate the ring from the crystal ring but place some tape or something on the lug so you don't scratch it. I usually place the knife at 11:00. Push it under the edge of the bezel ring. You may not even have to pry it up once you insert it far enough but you can tilt the knife a bit to pop it off. Flip the ring with insert still installed so you can push the insert out from the back with your thumbs. The washer can just be set aside for the time being. It should pop out fairly easily. Good time to clean everything at this point with a tooth brush and a little dishwashing soap.

To install, place the thin metal washer first. It should have a slight bend to it for friction. I usually install the insert in the bezel ring channel then work it into place with your thumbs around the outer edge. Use your thumbs to click it into place for the last bit. Try to work on it as close to the outer edge as possible so you do not bend the insert from the inner edge. If the last bit is too hard to get into place you can also try using a pencil with an eraser tip to push the last bit into place, again focusing on the outer edge of the insert. When mine is in place there is a slight snap. Use your fingernail to determine if it is seated all the way around the bezel ring. You can also use a loop to visually inspect. Then place the bezel ring with installed insert on the watch. Starting from one side use both thumbs in a circular path to snap it into place.

This guy on YouTube makes it look very easy: https://youtu.be/aW7gAfiyEvo?si=2Mid9YwrGkjJB8-w

Hope that helps!

[Hawkeye98]

Originally Posted by TimeLord2

Last post on this thread was almost a year ago and Walberg's comment almost 2 years old. I have done this with my 1675/3 several times and it has an 18K or 14K bezel ring. Use a knife to separate the ring from the crystal ring but place some tape or something on the lug so you don't scratch it. I usually place the knife at 11:00. Push it under the edge of the bezel ring. You may not even have to pry it up once you insert it far enough but you can tilt the knife a bit to pop it off. Flip the ring with insert still installed so you can push the insert out from the back with your thumbs. The washer can just be set aside for the time being. It should pop out fairly easily. Good time to clean everything at this point with a tooth brush and a little dishwashing soap.

To install, place the thin metal washer first. It should have a slight bend to it for friction. I usually install the insert in the bezel ring channel then work it into place with your thumbs around the outer edge. Use your thumbs to click it into place for the last bit. Try to work on it as close to the outer edge as possible so you do not bend the insert from the inner edge. If the last bit is too hard to get into place you can also try using a pencil with an eraser tip to push the last bit into place, again focusing on the outer edge of the insert. When mine is in place there is a slight snap. Use your fingernail to determine if it is seated all the way around the bezel ring. You can also use a loop to visually inspect. Then place the bezel ring with installed insert on the watch. Starting from one side use both thumbs in a circular path to snap it into place.

This guy on YouTube makes it look very easy: https://youtu.be/aW7gAfiyEvo?si=2Mid9YwrGkjJB8-w

Hope that helps!

Cheers! I'll buy you a steak dinner at Bavette's the next time you find yourself in Chicago!

[tadmcmichael]

Thread resurrection. I went to put my 1967 1675 on Tuesday morning and realized the bezel assembly was missing. As I have posted previously, this was my dad's watch that he purchased when he was deployed as a carrier pilot to Vietnam (at some point they stopped in Hong Kong.) My wife and I spent hours searching the bed, checked the laundry, under the bed, etc. Nowhere to be found. The last place I remembered checking the time was at church on Sunday. After the service I had changed a tire for an older gentleman when I noticed he had a flat. A week later, fortunately we were able to find him parked in the same handicapped spot and he was willing to let me tear the car apart looking for the bezel. I finally took the spare tire back out and tucked underneath was the bezel! Anyway, enough of my rambling and a few questions for the group:

1. I believe that this bezel insert is original to the watch based on the color, the red back, and the oval shape to the top of the 8s? I remember my dad cracking the crystal on our shrimp boat when I was a kid, but don't think the bezel was replaced.
2. As I spent the week searching for a replacement, it looks like these period correct inserts in this condition are worth several thousand? I ask because I'm considering buying a "service" insert and tucking the original one away for safe keeping. It was not a great feeling to have it missing for a week.
3. Based on TimeLord2 post above, it sounds like the best way to put it on is to insert the washer/spring into the bezel ring first? I had always seen the washer placed on the watch first before trying to seat the ring over it. Is there an aftermarket washer folks recommend that will be tight? I didn't find the original, but it wasn't secure anyway.

I don't come on here often, but really appreciate this group! Watch gets worn every day after 57 years. It is without a doubt my most prized possession.

[TimeLord2]

That is a beautiful insert! And IMHO looks very much original as the slightly bowed out sides on the arrow at the 24 hour marker is another indicator. You are correct on the pricing of an original if slightly faded insert.

If you have the bezel ring with the serrated edges off of the watch then that lovely insert you have goes into the ring first. When you put it back on the watch the flimsy metal washer goes on before the serrated bezel ring with insert installed. There should be a slight bend in the washer for friction so don't try to straighten it out. If it is flat as a pancake then give it a very slight bend. Then the bezel ring, with insert insert already installed, goes on next. Start on one side and press down on the outer edge of the serated bezel ring (with insert) using your thumbs and work all the way around using both hands. Just make sure when it is on and snaps down that it has some friction to it when rotating around. If not, you may need a service or some attention from a watchmaker with the tool that Springer had mentioned above.

You should be able to get a service insert from an AD (± $70) or even on EBAY (± $160), as the AD may insist that you service the watch before they can sell you another one. I have noticed EBAY prices for the insert are absolutely crazy. You're better off sourcing one from an AD. Although, if it was recently serviced and the numbers look good on the Time grapher, then they will probably replace it. Washer on EBAY: https://www.ebay.com/itm/310304838741

Another option, and this is probabaly the best one. Take the watch to the AD with your separate bezel ring and tell them you knocked it off and the insert is gone. They will sell you the insert and the washer assuming it is running well. Good luck!

[tadmcmichael]

Awesome, thanks for the info. I do have the outside knurled ring along with the insert (just not pictured), only the washer was lost.

I went to Brown and Company today as they are a RSC. They told me that it had to go in to Rolex to get a new service bezel along with a service. Mine is only a year out of service and within a minute a month accuracy, so not going to go through that expense. There are very few bezels like mine on ebay, but there are a ton of newer 1675 and 16750 blue back bezels in various degrees of condition. I'm guessing many of these are "service bezels"? I see some new ones for about $600 in the wrapper, which is a little steep. I may try to find a decent deal on a used one and put this one in the drawer in case I pop it off again. When did the "fat font" start and end? I don't think mine is fat font? Those fat font bezels look to be quite a premium over the service bezels.

[springer]

Originally Posted by tadmcmichael

Thread resurrection. I went to put my 1967 1675 on Tuesday morning and realized the bezel assembly was missing. As I have posted previously, this was my dad's watch that he purchased when he was deployed as a carrier pilot to Vietnam (at some point they stopped in Hong Kong.) My wife and I spent hours searching the bed, checked the laundry, under the bed, etc. Nowhere to be found. The last place I remembered checking the time was at church on Sunday. After the service I had changed a tire for an older gentleman when I noticed he had a flat. A week later, fortunately we were able to find him parked in the same handicapped spot and he was willing to let me tear the car apart looking for the bezel. I finally took the spare tire back out and tucked underneath was the bezel! Anyway, enough of my rambling and a few questions for the group:

1. I believe that this bezel insert is original to the watch based on the color, the red back, and the oval shape to the top of the 8s? I remember my dad cracking the crystal on our shrimp boat when I was a kid, but don't think the bezel was replaced.
2. As I spent the week searching for a replacement, it looks like these period correct inserts in this condition are worth several thousand? I ask because I'm considering buying a "service" insert and tucking the original one away for safe keeping. It was not a great feeling to have it missing for a week.
3. Based on TimeLord2 post above, it sounds like the best way to put it on is to insert the washer/spring into the bezel ring first? I had always seen the washer placed on the watch first before trying to seat the ring over it. Is there an aftermarket washer folks recommend that will be tight? I didn't find the original, but it wasn't secure anyway.

I don't come on here often, but really appreciate this group! Watch gets worn every day after 57 years. It is without a doubt my most prized possession.

The bezel flat springs are not that difficult to find. Try some of the watchmakers here or even try ebay.

Secondly, I don't know of many red back inserts worth several thousand dollars except super fat font inserts from the early 1970s and the fuchsia inserts from the late 1960s. Most nice, original red-backs are 2-3 thousand dollars.

The fuchsia and super fat fonts can bring 8-9 thousand dollars and more in excellent condition and free from any scratches or dings. But, alas, most inserts do not bring this type of "coin."

Below is a link with a few photos regarding bezel assemblies.

https://gmtforum.com/viewtopic.php?f...29ea0af9ee57cc