Unhappy with RSC Service

[8adam4]

Hello everybody!

I’m brand new to the forum, and this is my first post. I’ve been collecting modern and vintage Rolex’s for approximately 10 years now.

I have serviced my watches at RSC previously, and have been very happy with the service that I received. I recently acquired, a full set, Datejust Oysterquartz, reference 17000 (1979 model) and brought in for service. It was in amazing condition, but had been sitting for quite some time, so I wanted a complete overhaul done, while keeping everything else original.
Prior to service, the dial was in beautiful condition with pumpkin patina hour markers. After I dropped the watch off, and it was evaluated, they suggested that I replace the dial (probably because the tritium was no longer functional) but I refused, in order to keep the dial original, and the hour markers with the patina that I really enjoyed. The watch was barely worn by the original owner, and the bracelet and clasp were still very tight, almost from the factory-like, so they just did a light polish on the watch as well as the complete overhaul.

I got the watch back this week, and to my surprise two of the hour marker dots at the 9 o’clock and 11 o’clock were missing/damaged, and it’s pretty hard to photograph with my phone, but to be honest I wasn’t impressed with the polishing work on the watch either, especially since the watch was in such good condition to begin with.

I contacted them today, and since they take their own photographs of the watch, they already had them in their system of when I dropped it off, and after the service, so they could see what I was talking about. They have limited hours over the holidays, so we scheduled an appointment in the new year for me to bring the watch back, but I don’t know what that will do because in my opinion, the dial is irreplaceable in the condition that it was, with the patina that I really liked.

So I’m not sure what the resolution will be, and even if they offered a new dial, even at their expense, that will not be acceptable for me. Sorry for the novel, but has anybody had a similar experience with RSC?

Cheers,

Adam

[geoach]

they will replace the dial and polish the watch......

[brandrea]

Welcome to the forum Adam.

Sorry to hear about your experience. Move had nothing but great experiences with RSC Toronto, including a 5513 from about 1967.

That said, I’m not sure what will come of the meeting. I have a feeling about all they can do is replace the dial and re-polish the watch.

Let us know what happens.

[alllexandru]

the dial is damaged there is nothing you can do, as mentioned above probably most you get is new dial and repolish

if the original dial is a big issue for you I would sell the watch after getting it from service and look for another one with original dial untouched

[subtona]

Classic rsc. They have zero regard for original parts and patina.
They want to make your watch look exactly like the catalog and at the same time have no problem polishing away the original shape.

Really difficult to see a satisfactory resolution, some things cannot be undone.

Fwiw my experience with them has been consistently disappointing.
Most recently dropped off old watch for service. They required that I purchase an oem bracelet for the watch or they would refuse to service it. The watch is specifically worn on a strap and I never owned or wanted the original bracelet.
Extortion by straight up watch mafia.

[Henrimontgomery]

I had Rolex service my 17013 a while ago. I told them exactly what to do: replace the motor, clean the dial (it had dust) and leave everything untouched and like it is. No polishing, no part replacement, no action beside blowing air against the dial.

It came back exactly how I wanted it back, but I went myself to the Geneva HQ and gave my instruction to their horloger face to face. You have to be very careful where you drop your watches.

[77T]

Welcome to TRF despite the circumstances.

I presume you mean the tiny lume dots by the dials indices.




The missing ones can be replaced and color matched but it will never be original again. Nor does Rolex do this work. So you have that route.

If Rolex accepts full responsibility, you may be reimbursed for that expense. Alternatively, you may be offered a new service dial. Lastly, you might seek a perfect dial to replace yours but that has the same risk during installation.

When tritium dials age, the oxidized paint becomes unstable and even the slightest jarring while removing the hands can dislodge the 45 y.o. dots.


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[1William]

Sorry this happened. Keep us posted on how your meeting goes.

[CarlOver]

I think something of this vintage should go to a vintage service specialist that understands why you want to keep the watch in original condition. Good luck to you!

[ronricks]

I would have requested no polish. Luke probably came off when they disassembled the watch.

[8adam4]

Thanks for the welcome, and the replies.

I have a feeling I’m going to have a brand new dial at the end of all this, and I’m hoping they eat the initial service costs, but I kind of doubt that. We shall see!

[csaltphoto]

As another post mentioned this style of lume is just blobs of paint. When it dries out it becomes unstable, just like old paint in a house. It flakes and cracks, loses it's adhesive qualities and can completely fall off. Every watch ages differently and there is just no way to predict the stability of the lume. There are vintage specialists who can "stabilize" the lume which probably involves coating with some kind of matte lacquer. Rolex, for the most part, doesn't care about vintage aspects and even more so if the lume is unstable enough to present a potential issue with flaking lume particles getting into the works of the watch.

Hopefully this can be resolved to your satisfaction but unfortunately going into it there was no way to predict how your lume would behave. A vintage watch specialist might have done better but even then, there is no way to know if some of the lume might have needed to be color matched and replaced.

[paul cbc]

Originally Posted by 8adam4

Thanks for the welcome, and the replies.

I have a feeling I’m going to have a brand new dial at the end of all this, and I’m hoping they eat the initial service costs, but I kind of doubt that. We shall see!

I'd try asking for this - service dial and reversal of service charges.
Think it would be the best outcome for this existing watch. Also, since they have already polished the watch, why not ask them to touch it up?

[8adam4]

Originally Posted by paul cbc

I'd try asking for this - service dial and reversal of service charges.
Think it would be the best outcome for this existing watch. Also, since they have already polished the watch, why not ask them to touch it up?

I agree, I’m thinking that’s the only acceptable option for me at this point, or at least that’s what I’m going to suggest. When I dropped the watch for servicing I didn’t even consider that the dial would be damaged in any way, I’ve only had positive experiences with RSC before, and I went into it with the “you get what you pay for” mentality.

[Mystro]

RSC has done average work at best and nothing to gush about. It’s basic multi hands on watch, high volume work. It’s always been a roll of the dice with RSC and that is at Dallas or NY.
If you need priority attention then you need a specialist like Rikki.

http://www.timecareinc.com/

[t65tampa]

Even in the most careful of hands, old tritium markers on dials or hands can crack or disintegrate with the tiniest bit of manipulation.


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[t65tampa]

Originally Posted by Mystro

RSC has done average work at best and nothing to gush about. It’s basic multi hands on watch, high volume work. It’s always been a roll of the dice with RSC and that is at Dallas or NY.
If you need priority attention then you need a specialist like Rikki.

http://www.timecareinc.com/

Yep. I agree! He’s fantastic and he has an extensive authentic, original Rolex parts arsenal.


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[Tools]

If you want to keep your original, but damaged, dial then you would need to seek a specialist to remove the damaged plots and replace with color matched non-lume repairs.

It is simply a matter of either a functional, but with replacement parts, watch or a properly restored but original dial.

[Onequik135i]

I would recommend Phillip Ridley to color match the lume markers, he’s one of several guys out there that specialize in vintage.

[77T]

Originally Posted by Tools

It is simply a matter of either a functional, but with replacement parts, watch or a properly restored but original dial.

I agree Larry - the better route could be to accept the RSCs service dial (if they offer that to the OP).

Otherwise, refinishing is a cost effective route.


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[Easy Rhino]

Originally Posted by Mystro

RSC has done average work at best and nothing to gush about. It’s basic multi hands on watch, high volume work. It’s always been a roll of the dice with RSC and that is at Dallas or NY.
If you need priority attention then you need a specialist like Rikki.

http://www.timecareinc.com/

Exactly. Reading on this forum where others had original parts replaced by the RSCs that resulted in disappointments, I sought out the alternative, which happened to be Rik at TimeCare. My 19 year old 14060M has been to him twice, each time with outstanding results and service. I will not trust my watches to anyone else (although I'm sure that there are other good watchmakers out there).

[Bxtek]

One of the biggest things I have learned from this forum, is to never take a vintage watch to RSC. Especially if you're concerned about originality/preservation. Too many horror stories.

[CarlOver]

I would guess you paid a premium for this watch. And would have paid less for a watch with service dial or maybe you wouldn’t even have considered a watch with service dial. Best to you and keep us posted how RSC handles this.

[8adam4]

Thanks for all of the info and suggestions, I appreciate it!

*Update, the watch was dropped off yesterday to the AD, and they will be getting back to me next week on what they decide. Not only am I disappointed of the damaged/missing lume markers on the dial, but I’m more shocked that they didn't bring it to my attention, and put the watch back together and returned it to me that way.

Here’s a picture of the watch after the service:

[kritameth]

This is exactly why I’ve concluded when it comes time to service my dear beloved I’ll be faced with exactly two options, 1) scour for an independent watchmaker worth his/her salt, 2) stop by a RSC and set the watch on fire.

[Devildog]

Originally Posted by csaltphoto

As another post mentioned this style of lume is just blobs of paint. When it dries out it becomes unstable, just like old paint in a house. It flakes and cracks, loses it's adhesive qualities and can completely fall off. Every watch ages differently and there is just no way to predict the stability of the lume. There are vintage specialists who can "stabilize" the lume which probably involves coating with some kind of matte lacquer. Rolex, for the most part, doesn't care about vintage aspects and even more so if the lume is unstable enough to present a potential issue with flaking lume particles getting into the works of the watch.

Hopefully this can be resolved to your satisfaction but unfortunately going into it there was no way to predict how your lume would behave. A vintage watch specialist might have done better but even then, there is no way to know if some of the lume might have needed to be color matched and replaced.

This - 100%.

Its unfair to blame the RSC - chances are that the simple act of removing the dial (however carefully) on disassembly or even gently air blowing the dial could cause an old tritium plot to disintegrate, especially ones of that size.

The OP should, however, have been alerted to that likelihood on submitting the watch for service.

[joli160]

Originally Posted by Devildog

This - 100%.

Its unfair to blame the RSC - chances are that the simple act of removing the dial (however carefully) on disassembly or even gently air blowing the dial could cause an old tritium plot to disintegrate, especially ones of that size.

The OP should, however, have been alerted to that likelihood on submitting the watch for service.

Sure, but the RSC watchmaker should have alerted the OP when it did happen and offer a satisfactory solution.