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Joseph T · 5 March 2018, 06:18 AM

Good afternoon,

I am fairly new to Rolex world and I seeking some advice about my first purchase.
I have found a Submariner 116610LN for sale on regular buy/sell platform.
I have spoke to the gentleman who seems a nice man and we chatted about watches for some time on the phone. He explained that the watch was brought for a friend that promised he would pay him money for the watch and never did. the watch has only been worn 3-4 times.
He has sent me pictures of the watch with box, papers, and most importantly a original receipt from Mappin and Webb from last year.
It all looks the part from the pictures.
I asked him if he could meet me at my local Maplin and Webb to have the watch looked at by there on site watch maker before we exchange money and he said he is more than happy to do so. I have spoken to Maplin and Webb who have said they will look at the watch but are not willing to take the back off to look at the inner workings because they are not authorised to do so, and explained that it would voide the 5 year warrenty still on the watch.
With all this information it should be lagitamate, right?
I am just not sure what extent the fraudsters will go to?

I Appreciate you taking the time to read this post and I would like to apologise in advance if this is something that you wouldn’t tend to ask on a forum like this.

Kind regards,
Joseph

Watcheroo · 5 March 2018, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph T

He explained that the watch was brought for a friend that promised he would pay him money for the watch and never did.

^^ That would be enough for me to walk away. Source one from a trusted seller on this forum.

Good luck

FTX I · 5 March 2018, 07:05 AM

Do you think you're able to spot a fake watch? Sales people are not the best at this as well. TBH I don't like his story. Bought for someone, didn't get the money, I don't know. In your shoes I'd put my name on some authorized dealer's list and get a brand new watch. Good luck.

catsby90 · 5 March 2018, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Watcheroo

^^ That would be enough for me to walk away. Source one from a trusted seller on this forum.

Good luck

Either this or find another independent authorized dealer from whom the seller is not claiming to have purchased and have them verify it.

RedLs3 · 5 March 2018, 07:10 AM

Order the caseback tool set online. $50 is cheap insurance and has been useful for me a handful of times. The chinese are getting good at replicating movements and even the red/purple gears. However the chances of you finding a fake with a genuine 3135 movement in it is very very slim too none.. just my 2 cents. You def need to open her up to verify for peace of mind, i do this for all my rolexes, even if its from an AD or vetted TRF seller, its your money dont trust anyone

masyv6 · 5 March 2018, 07:31 AM

Buy the seller. If you have any doubts, find another seller.

RollieRoll · 5 March 2018, 01:21 PM

No way, unless you can go to a RSC to authenticate. Sorry.

Flyinghunter · 5 March 2018, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masyv6

Buy the seller. If you have any doubts, find another seller.

Great advice here^^^. The trusted sellers on this forum is where to start.

RollieRoll · 5 March 2018, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Watcheroo

^^ That would be enough for me to walk away. Source one from a trusted seller on this forum.

Good luck

I agree . Got for a friend and didn't pay me? It's strange bc I know another seller who said the same thing for a much higher priced timepiece....I don't like these strange backgrounds. If you feel at all uncomfortable then just walk away

GradyPhilpott · 5 March 2018, 01:41 PM

Don't do it.

Forget this source completely and buy from a trusted, established source.

dafuture · 5 March 2018, 01:52 PM

I would not trust the store's word if they're not willing to do a full inspection. I'd have him meet you at an RSC (if possible) and see if they can authenticate. Otherwise, I can't imagine in this market that he's offering enough of a discount that it wouldn't be worth it to just order from a trusted seller or AD and have that extra piece of mind.

JacksonStone · 5 March 2018, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Watcheroo

^^ That would be enough for me to walk away. Source one from a trusted seller on this forum.

Good luck

Agreed. That line would have my radar going full tilt.

Old Expat Beast · 5 March 2018, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph T

With all this information it should be lagitamate, right?

Wrong.

Follow the advice above. Scammers work way harder than you would think, including setting up long cons on this forum, to swindle trusting folks out of their money.

joli160 · 5 March 2018, 07:21 PM

The seller is ready to have it authenticated at an official AD. He probably expects the AD's watchmaker to remove the case back.
This would take away my doubts and I would proceed in this way.

The AD should also be able to verify the invoice, since the watch came from the same chain.

Not everybody is a scammer.

Having said that,
I don't like the "friends" story and that would caution me. Try talk the AD in removing the case back. It does not void the warranty imho and only takes a minute of time.

Joseph T · 6 March 2018, 05:25 PM

So if I take it to an AD and they take the case back off it with all the documentation you would still be wary?
If the case back comes off with a AD watchmaker looking at it, that should be foolproof right?

And I would like to sinsearly thank everyone for your help. He said he jumped on the waiting list about a year ago and wasn’t going to get the watch but he fiends said grab it because I’ll have it. As the waiting for the watch was 1-2 years.

Failing that anyone have one for sale haha

ohjnxg · 6 March 2018, 05:42 PM

yeap the movement should be fool proof

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Devildog · 6 March 2018, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph T

So if I take it to an AD and they take the case back off it with all the documentation you would still be wary?
If the case back comes off with a AD watchmaker looking at it, that should be foolproof right?

And I would like to sinsearly thank everyone for your help. He said he jumped on the waiting list about a year ago and wasn’t going to get the watch but he fiends said grab it because I’ll have it. As the waiting for the watch was 1-2 years.

Failing that anyone have one for sale haha

If the serial numbers on the card and the watch match both the invoice from Mappin & Webb and (this is critical) Mappin and Webb’s own records confirm the date, serial numbers and all other details and the movement checks out then you should be fine.

If Mappin and Webb won’t open it, see if there is a grey reseller or certified watchmaker near by who will for a small fee

Joseph T · 6 March 2018, 06:01 PM

.

Joseph T · 6 March 2018, 06:03 PM

Thanks delivDog ��

MY-WATCH · 6 March 2018, 09:35 PM

Take it to RSC to authenticate it before buying

Spartan1 · 6 March 2018, 10:10 PM

Steer clear and listen to those before me.

brandrea · 6 March 2018, 10:14 PM

Is there an update?

Easy E · 6 March 2018, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joli160

The seller is ready to have it authenticated at an official AD. He probably expects the AD's watchmaker to remove the case back.
This would take away my doubts and I would proceed in this way.

The AD should also be able to verify the invoice, since the watch came from the same chain.

Not everybody is a scammer.

Having said that,
I don't like the "friends" story and that would caution me. Try talk the AD in removing the case back. It does not void the warranty imho and only takes a minute of time.

Some truth to this.

Seems to me they can validate the original invoice way easier. If they are not in the habit of removing case backs and suddenly decide they are going to do you a "solid" i would put little stock in their movement assessment. Validate the original sales invoice first.

I think the "friend" story smells. But, it smells so bad it may actually be true. Seems to me that if someone was working that hard to scam you they could come up with a much better story.

Bottom line, when in doubt don't.

As others have mentioned for good reason, buy the seller.

Good luck. Please do post an update and maybe a photo of you new watch.

E-

MJ8 · 6 March 2018, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph T

Good afternoon,

I am fairly new to Rolex world and I seeking some advice about my first purchase.
I have found a Submariner 116610LN for sale on regular buy/sell platform.
I have spoke to the gentleman who seems a nice man and we chatted about watches for some time on the phone. He explained that the watch was brought for a friend that promised he would pay him money for the watch and never did. the watch has only been worn 3-4 times.
He has sent me pictures of the watch with box, papers, and most importantly a original receipt from Mappin and Webb from last year.
It all looks the part from the pictures.
I asked him if he could meet me at my local Maplin and Webb to have the watch looked at by there on site watch maker before we exchange money and he said he is more than happy to do so. I have spoken to Maplin and Webb who have said they will look at the watch but are not willing to take the back off to look at the inner workings because they are not authorised to do so, and explained that it would voide the 5 year warrenty still on the watch.
With all this information it should be lagitamate, right?
I am just not sure what extent the fraudsters will go to?

I Appreciate you taking the time to read this post and I would like to apologise in advance if this is something that you wouldn’t tend to ask on a forum like this.

Kind regards,
Joseph

I am actually in the process of selling my submariner, if you are interested https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=590251

Joseph T · 7 March 2018, 12:48 AM

So just to sum it up, and thank you so much for all your help everyone.

If I get a AD with a verified watchmaker that is willing to take the case back off and produce a cert for me. The AD I know has a watchmaker with 35y Experiance.
I ring Mappin and Webb to confirm the date day name place of where it was purchased and check that that is as per the invoice.
Look at the cerial number on the watch match the information given by Mappin and Webb as will as the AD watchmaker doing so as well.
I “SHOULD” be fine. I am a very cautious person so if the selling doesn’t “smell” right I won’t be doing the biz!

Thanks again I will drop some info on here after Thursday to let you know if I went with it or not.

5 March 2018, 06:18 AM	#1
Joseph T "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Stafford UK Posts: 5	Buying my first Sub Mariner Good afternoon, I am fairly new to Rolex world and I seeking some advice about my first purchase. I have found a Submariner 116610LN for sale on regular buy/sell platform. I have spoke to the gentleman who seems a nice man and we chatted about watches for some time on the phone. He explained that the watch was brought for a friend that promised he would pay him money for the watch and never did. the watch has only been worn 3-4 times. He has sent me pictures of the watch with box, papers, and most importantly a original receipt from Mappin and Webb from last year. It all looks the part from the pictures. I asked him if he could meet me at my local Maplin and Webb to have the watch looked at by there on site watch maker before we exchange money and he said he is more than happy to do so. I have spoken to Maplin and Webb who have said they will look at the watch but are not willing to take the back off to look at the inner workings because they are not authorised to do so, and explained that it would voide the 5 year warrenty still on the watch. With all this information it should be lagitamate, right? I am just not sure what extent the fraudsters will go to? I Appreciate you taking the time to read this post and I would like to apologise in advance if this is something that you wouldn’t tend to ask on a forum like this. Kind regards, Joseph

5 March 2018, 01:41 PM	#10
GradyPhilpott 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: New Mexico Watch: Seiko #SRK050 Posts: 34,453	Don't do it. Forget this source completely and buy from a trusted, established source. __________________ JJ Inaugural TRF $50 Watch Challenge Winner

5 March 2018, 01:52 PM	#11
dafuture "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: NYC Posts: 1,944	I would not trust the store's word if they're not willing to do a full inspection. I'd have him meet you at an RSC (if possible) and see if they can authenticate. Otherwise, I can't imagine in this market that he's offering enough of a discount that it wouldn't be worth it to just order from a trusted seller or AD and have that extra piece of mind. __________________ Current Rolex Submariner 126610LN \|\| Cartier Tank Americaine

5 March 2018, 07:21 PM	#14
joli160 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: NL Watch: Yachtmaster Posts: 14,744	The seller is ready to have it authenticated at an official AD. He probably expects the AD's watchmaker to remove the case back. This would take away my doubts and I would proceed in this way. The AD should also be able to verify the invoice, since the watch came from the same chain. Not everybody is a scammer. Having said that, I don't like the "friends" story and that would caution me. Try talk the AD in removing the case back. It does not void the warranty imho and only takes a minute of time. __________________ Day Date 18238, Yachtmaster 16622, Deepsea 116660, Submariner 116619, SkyD 326935, DJ 178271, DJ 69158, Yachtmaster 169622, GMT 116713LN, GMT 126711.

5 March 2018, 07:05 AM	#3
FTX I "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Real Name: Flavio Location: N/A Posts: 14,654	Do you think you're able to spot a fake watch? Sales people are not the best at this as well. TBH I don't like his story. Bought for someone, didn't get the money, I don't know. In your shoes I'd put my name on some authorized dealer's list and get a brand new watch. Good luck.

5 March 2018, 07:10 AM	#5
RedLs3 Banned Join Date: Feb 2018 Location: NYC Posts: 283	Order the caseback tool set online. $50 is cheap insurance and has been useful for me a handful of times. The chinese are getting good at replicating movements and even the red/purple gears. However the chances of you finding a fake with a genuine 3135 movement in it is very very slim too none.. just my 2 cents. You def need to open her up to verify for peace of mind, i do this for all my rolexes, even if its from an AD or vetted TRF seller, its your money dont trust anyone

5 March 2018, 07:31 AM	#6
masyv6 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Real Name: Mike Location: 35000ft Posts: 3,771	Buy the seller. If you have any doubts, find another seller.

5 March 2018, 01:21 PM	#7
RollieRoll Banned Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: US Posts: 658	No way, unless you can go to a RSC to authenticate. Sorry.

6 March 2018, 05:25 PM	#15
Joseph T "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Stafford UK Posts: 5	So if I take it to an AD and they take the case back off it with all the documentation you would still be wary? If the case back comes off with a AD watchmaker looking at it, that should be foolproof right? And I would like to sinsearly thank everyone for your help. He said he jumped on the waiting list about a year ago and wasn’t going to get the watch but he fiends said grab it because I’ll have it. As the waiting for the watch was 1-2 years. Failing that anyone have one for sale haha

6 March 2018, 05:42 PM	#16
ohjnxg "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Singapore Posts: 40	yeap the movement should be fool proof Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

6 March 2018, 06:01 PM	#18
Joseph T "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Stafford UK Posts: 5	.

6 March 2018, 06:03 PM	#19
Joseph T "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Stafford UK Posts: 5	Thanks delivDog ��

6 March 2018, 09:35 PM	#20
MY-WATCH "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Real Name: Sala hu din Location: N/A Posts: 1,781	Take it to RSC to authenticate it before buying

6 March 2018, 10:10 PM	#21
Spartan1 "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: USA Posts: 238	Steer clear and listen to those before me.

6 March 2018, 10:14 PM	#22
brandrea 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Brian (TBone) Location: canada Watch: es make me smile Posts: 77,897	Is there an update?

7 March 2018, 12:48 AM	#25
Joseph T "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Stafford UK Posts: 5	So just to sum it up, and thank you so much for all your help everyone. If I get a AD with a verified watchmaker that is willing to take the case back off and produce a cert for me. The AD I know has a watchmaker with 35y Experiance. I ring Mappin and Webb to confirm the date day name place of where it was purchased and check that that is as per the invoice. Look at the cerial number on the watch match the information given by Mappin and Webb as will as the AD watchmaker doing so as well. I “SHOULD” be fine. I am a very cautious person so if the selling doesn’t “smell” right I won’t be doing the biz! Thanks again I will drop some info on here after Thursday to let you know if I went with it or not.

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