Bought Rolex but received Empty Box--HELP

[helo008]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

Who is the seller?

The seller is william21. He's been very communicative throughout the whole process.

The original listing is named: FSOT: ROLEX GMT MASTER II 116710LN Complete Set, Random Serial, Excellent Condition

[antbkny]

That’s terrible man. Does it look like the box was repackaged?

[Old Expat Beast]

Originally Posted by helo008

The seller is william21. He's been very communicative throughout the whole process.

The original listing is named: FSOT: ROLEX GMT MASTER II 116710LN Complete Set, Random Serial, Excellent Condition

Did you check his references? Seems he has only sold one watch (yours) on TRF. Right now it's either him, you or a third party at fault, and while it's the seller's responsibility to get the watch into your hands after payment, it's his word against yours. Good luck. Hopefully the seller will get organised with the insurance and a refund.

[helo008]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

Did you check his references? Seems he has only sold one watch (yours) on TRF. Right now it's either him, you or a third party at fault, and while it's the seller's responsibility to get the watch into your hands after payment, it's his word against yours. Good luck. Hopefully the seller will get organised with the insurance and a refund.

I did and found some positive references, but now that you point it out I realize those are purchase references, not sale references.

In addition to that we also exchanged Linkedins and talked a little on the phone, and I did some google searching to match up the phone number with real person and it all lined up.

Thanks for the good wishes--I really hope this concludes well. Would you happen to know how generally refund policy works in situations like these? Should I ask for one now or let things play out?

[Old Expat Beast]

Originally Posted by helo008

I did and found some positive references, but now that you point it out I realize those are purchase references, not sale references.

In addition to that we also exchanged Linkedins and talked a little on the phone, and I did some google searching to match up the phone number with real person and it all lined up.

Thanks for the good wishes--I really hope this concludes well. Would you happen to know how generally refund policy works in situations like these? Should I ask for one now or let things play out?

There is no set refund Policy as such. TRF only supplies a space for folks to sell stuff, and they make their own policies. As long as no one breaks the law, or the sales forums rules, they can operate pretty much how they wish.

[helo008]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

There is no set refund Policy as such. TRF only supplies a space for folks to sell stuff, and they make their own policies. As long as no one breaks the law, or the sales forums rules, they can operate pretty much how they wish.

Yup I totally understand, I'm just wondering how in instances like this what common practice is. Sorry, this is my first time actually buying after lurking for a while so I'm not quite familiar with how transactions work when they go wrong.

[Old Expat Beast]

Originally Posted by helo008

Yup I totally understand, I'm just wondering how in instances like this what common practice is. Sorry, this is my first time actually buying after lurking for a while so I'm not quite familiar with how transactions work when they go wrong.

Honestly, I can't recall an instance like this before...that's to say, empty box received and seller still engaging with buyer (which is a good sign, by the way). I'm guessing the seller will want to get his insurance payment before refunding you, whereas one of the big sellers might have refunded you sooner.

[helo008]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

Honestly, I can't recall an instance like this before...that's to say, empty box received and seller still engaging with buyer (which is a good sign, by the way). I'm guessing the seller will want to get his insurance payment before refunding you, whereas one of the big sellers might have refunded you sooner.

Yeah, I figured if it were just a scam then he would have ghosted me as soon as he received the funds or I received the package, but then again I've also never had anything stolen out of a package with the rest of the package re-sealed and sent on.

Thanks for the info--hopefully UPS will issue the refund then :/

[Tools]

Originally Posted by helo008

Yup I totally understand, I'm just wondering how in instances like this what common practice is. Sorry, this is my first time actually buying after lurking for a while so I'm not quite familiar with how transactions work when they go wrong.

You have not received your purchase and so it is entirely reasonable to ask for your money back.

The seller is who UPS will deal with as the shipper, so recovering insurance is on them.

[brockburst]

.

[~Haze~]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

There is no set refund Policy as such. TRF only supplies a space for folks to sell stuff, and they make their own policies. As long as no one breaks the law, or the sales forums rules, they can operate pretty much how they wish.

Well, it is still fraud. I know the op stated it was shipped ups and I'm not sure whether the ups is considered mail which would escalate it to mail fraud but it still has potential and laws have definitely been broken.

That being said, I'm not suggesting anything nefarious has taken place between the buyer and seller but it makes you think listing the contents and insuring then may have put a big bullseye on the package.

[freefly]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

Right now it's either him, you or a third party at fault, and while it's the seller's responsibility to get the watch into your hands after payment, it's his word against yours. Good luck. Hopefully the seller will get organised with the insurance and a refund.

You bring up an interesting/valid point. While it seems that the OP is being honest/truthful about this matter, the fact is that buyer scams are just as plausible/possible as seller scams.
Not saying that's the case here at all, but it certainly wouldn't be the first time the old "I got an empty box!" scam was run.

Again, so far it sounds like the OP is being truthful, but just goes to show how "messy" these situations can become.
The mantra around here is always "buy the seller" but I think there should also be some weight given to "sell the buyer" as well.
This is especially pertinent if/when accepting forms of payment other than a bank wire. Just my $0.02...

[MinMay]

Originally Posted by freefly

you bring up an interesting/valid point. While it seems that the op is being honest/truthful about this matter, the fact is that buyer scams are just as plausible/possible as seller scams.
Not saying that's the case here at all, but it certainly wouldn't be the first time the old "i got an empty box!" scam was run.

Again, so far it sounds like the op is being truthful, but just goes to show how "messy" these situations can become.
The mantra around here is always "buy the seller" but i think there should also be some weight given to "sell the buyer" as well.
This is especially pertinent if/when accepting forms of payment other than a bank wire. Just my $0.02...

+1 Can you imagine more buyers making such claim "I got an empty box?"

[helo008]

Originally Posted by freefly

You bring up an interesting/valid point. While it seems that the OP is being honest/truthful about this matter, the fact is that buyer scams are just as plausible/possible as seller scams.
Not saying that's the case here at all, but it certainly wouldn't be the first time the old "I got an empty box!" scam was run.

Again, so far it sounds like the OP is being truthful, but just goes to show how "messy" these situations can become.
The mantra around here is always "buy the seller" but I think there should also be some weight given to "sell the buyer" as well.
This is especially pertinent if/when accepting forms of payment other than a bank wire. Just my $0.02...

Totally see what you're getting at and understand the perspective entirely.

All I can say is that the situation is such that I waited with my housemate for the watch to arrive this morning until 11am (despite scheduled delivery at 10:30am) so I could receive it in person, but had to send him off to the airport.

I received notice it arrived at the office of my building at 11:29am, which is a full glass area run by two employees that have been working there for years and receive dozens of packages a day, so I doubt they tampered with it.

I came home and picked it up at 12:18pm when I returned from the airport. Shot a message with the picture of the empty contents at 12:21pm to the seller, and called him 3 times within the next 50 minutes before he picked up and confirmed he had indeed not forgotten to pack the watch, at which point I promptly called the local PD, which had an officer there within 20 minutes.

After this happened I documented all of this in case it needed to be used as evidence later on. This is my second Rolex and I purchased it to celebrate my business hitting a milestone, and I had even been in talks with the dealer of my previous Rolex, an Explorer II, to sell my old one back to fund this purchase as it was supposed to be a "trade up".

I then came on TRF to seek some help and advice on this matter. All I can say is that everything I've said is entirely truthful, and that I would never do something like this. It hurts me to see that the fruit of my hard work has pretty much been spent on an empty box.