Richard Mille trolling ;)

[boursachi]

well guys, i will stir up some drama here

who has moved from an AP to an RM?
which model from AP and to which model from RM?

has anyone done the opposite, from RM to AP?

let the ripping commence

[kilyung]

RM is still building their case making facility. Many RMs are actually assembled by AP's Renaud et Papi in Le Locle so there's a lot of similar DNA in both brands. I don't see it as one vs the other. I almost pulled the trigger on a RM10 and RM11 but some early movement production issues and the $6k minimum service cost has me waiting a little longer to see how durable these watches are.

[mask1196]

Originally Posted by kilyung

RM is still building their case making facility. Many RMs are actually assembled by AP's Renaud et Papi in Le Locle so there's a lot of similar DNA in both brands. I don't see it as one vs the other. I almost pulled the trigger on a RM10 and RM11 but some early movement production issues and the $6k minimum service cost has me waiting a little longer to see how durable these watches are.

x2

[TSW]

A 11 in Ti is definitely on my list

[mask1196]

Originally Posted by TSW

A 11 in Ti is definitely on my list

Nice Thomas.
I'm thinking to add a Rolf 75. What ya think?

[kilyung]

Originally Posted by TSW

A 11 in Ti is definitely on my list

Hey Thomas, the RG looks better on you mate!

[boursachi]

i absolutely agree and believe that the ROO line specifically has a lot in common with the RM automatic/chrono lines. in fact, i was even more impressed with the brand as a whole because of the APRP linkage, as well as RM not trying to be something he/they are not
i tried the RM011 in RG yesterday, i loved the presence but the dial was just too busy. i also have no use for yet another chronograph. i am most interested in the RM010 Ti, after doing extensive research and realizing it is the way to go - i found an RM005 Ti FM (ltd 300pcs) that is LNIB for a good price (i think), but after much thought it would be too similar to the BB in its feel for one thing; and more importantly, the RM010 is more skeletonized
i did find an RM011 Ti as well, so that makes an RM005 Ti FM and an RM011 FM found and have been presented with decent offers in 48hrs.. but no luck with the 10 Ti?

ps: i am not certain that any assembling takes place outside the RM facility. as i am under the impression that despite sourcing the movements (tailored to specific requirements) and parts (all from switzerland) from others, the assembly and overall finishing is done at RM

edit for the non-RM-inclined here are:
RM005 Ti FM (ltd 300pc)


RM010 Ti


good pics here to show differences between RM010 and RM005

RM011 Ti FM

[TSW]

Originally Posted by kilyung

Hey Thomas, the RG looks better on you mate!

Well Mike I do need a gold piece in my collection

[Manofsteelpt]

Mike... $6k min service for RM?!?!?! I really like the RM10, and also saw a RM05fm for a nice deal, but that's ridic for svc fees

[HL65]

Well I have come real close to getting an RM 11 Ti but in the end just couldn't pull the trigger. I ended up with a Patek 5960P instead and decided if I want a fun weekend watch I will turn to my RBII Ti which I much prefer. I understand the allure but still have too many questions about their future and demand over the years etc.
Cheers,

[texex91]

I personally like the RM.

Different watch, very unique and limited.

Would I spend that kind of $, probably not.

But never say never

[highdiver]

Originally Posted by texex91

I personally like the RM.

Different watch, very unique and limited.

Would I spend that kind of $, probably not.

But never say never

+1.

I will probably consider a used one and or get it from auction, if ever.

[Submarino]

Beautiful but not for me. I personally don't like the shape of their cases. n:

[witch watch]

Originally Posted by Manofsteelpt

Mike... $6k min service for RM?!?!?! but that's ridic for svc fees

Exactly what i was thinking

[vpr80]

Beautiful watches, can't justify the cost. At that level, I want history and reputation so that it's really worth the money. I would go for Patek in those dollars.

Interesting story, I was in switzerland approx 8-10 years ago and saw a Quinting in a high-end store. Asked to see it as the girl put on gloves and with hands shaking, handed it to me. I couldn't understand what she was so nervous over, until I asked the price. $250k. At which point I handed it back to her and said thank you. Coon and unique watch, but $250k, is that a joke! Then 3 or 4 years later, someone was selling one (I think he still is actually) for like $3k and cannot find one person to buy it. Moral of the story, RM needs a lot more history to make sure those prices stick. Unless all of their customers are billionaires and don't care about dropping $50-$100k :-)

[boursachi]

Originally Posted by SteelerFan65

Well I have come real close to getting an RM 11 Ti but in the end just couldn't pull the trigger. I ended up with a Patek 5960P instead and decided if I want a fun weekend watch I will turn to my RBII Ti which I much prefer. I understand the allure but still have too many questions about their future and demand over the years etc.
Cheers,

the 5960p is definitely the better watch than the RM011 Ti and i do not think anyone can argue except based on purposes for the watch (i.e. the look and the loads extra sportiness of the RM). HUGE CONGRATS and well done on that decision.
i am however not shopping in that price bracket + not interested in an RM011 based on the chrono function plus the fact that the dial is just too busy

i will admit however that i was adamant on a 5726 as a next watch, until i tried on a 5102 and asked myself shouldn't my first and probably only patek which will be the jewel of my humble collection a ROUND one? and in PLATINUM since it's my favourite ELEMENT and not just metal? (i do not wear gold so that limits my choices from PP as well).
right now, i think i am fixated on a 5130p because unfortunately the 5131's dial is not made in platinum :( is it?!?!!

ps: mind you, the 5726 was picked based on the fact that it is an annual calendar.. and the rm010 is picked due to it being a skeletonized automatic
the 5130p offers not a function that i wish to have (world time), but the platinum, dial, roundedness, class, timelessness, and just AESTHETICS make me forget the make and the fact it is a PP and pick it over an annual + skeleton combined haha :)

Originally Posted by Submarino

Beautiful but not for me. I personally don't like the shape of their cases. n:

what do you make of their new stuff? the diver? the square extra thin? :)

Originally Posted by vpr80

Beautiful watches, can't justify the cost. At that level, I want history and reputation so that it's really worth the money. I would go for Patek in those dollars.
Moral of the story, RM needs a lot more history to make sure those prices stick. Unless all of their customers are billionaires and don't care about dropping $50-$100k :-)

allow me to copy paste what i have written in another forum regarding the exact same thing ;)

i know what you mean. i would explain it with an analogy to a Pagani car really.. the beating heart of a piece is from another manufacturer (AMG, Vaucher / Renaud & Papi), the design and concept is derived from an exquisite point of view rather than heritage, attention is paid to fine details, going overboard on everything (engraving titanium screws that go on a door of a pagani?), and making sure exclusivity is the main lure, not the numbers while ensuring that they do not give in to norms. i for one do not subscribe to writing off RM as a flashy brand, just as much as i wouldn't write off a pagani to be anything less than a bugatti with the vw funding. never got into that especially when keeping up with their updates and manufacturing and the amount of science that goes into their watches. as a car nut, i get what he is doing with the brand as well. from a marketing pov, they are doing what the swiss watchmakers are doing, endorsements and sponsorhips in sports, movies, and punching out "limited editions" with only painting the bezel a different colour and charging x-times extra.
of course the pricing is laughable, but imho even a rolex/omega/iwc, a tag for that matter, is "overpriced"
personally, the rm010 is just as beautiful a skeleton watch as an RO (oh no i didn't lol) for example or any other that offers it

[vpr80]

Originally Posted by boursachi

i know what you mean. i would explain it with an analogy to a Pagani car really.. the beating heart of a piece is from another manufacturer (AMG, Vaucher / Renaud & Papi), the design and concept is derived from an exquisite point of view rather than heritage, attention is paid to fine details, going overboard on everything (engraving titanium screws that go on a door of a pagani?), and making sure exclusivity is the main lure, not the numbers while ensuring that they do not give in to norms. i for one do not subscribe to writing off RM as a flashy brand, just as much as i wouldn't write off a pagani to be anything less than a bugatti with the vw funding. never got into that especially when keeping up with their updates and manufacturing and the amount of science that goes into their watches. as a car nut, i get what he is doing with the brand as well. from a marketing pov, they are doing what the swiss watchmakers are doing, endorsements and sponsorhips in sports, movies, and punching out "limited editions" with only painting the bezel a different colour and charging x-times extra.
of course the pricing is laughable, but imho even a rolex/omega/iwc, a tag for that matter, is "overpriced"
personally, the rm010 is just as beautiful a skeleton watch as an RO (oh no i didn't lol) for example or any other that offers it

That is actually a great comparison....too bad I can't get anywhere near either one....but if I do hit the lotto in the near future, I will enjoy my RM as I take the Zonda out for a spin :)

[patek.wis]

I see them as the 'Franck muller' of this decade. Wait ten years and I don't think they'll be relevant. I'm sorry in advance but I truly believe this.

AP on the other hand. Awesome :)

[Marrk]

I like RM and look forward to learning more about them and seeing how they develop as a manufacture, if they do develop that way. Right now, they seem to have some interesting design ideas.

What's with the $6,000 minimum service fees? What is that about and can someone please provide something in the way of substantiation of this?

[boursachi]

Originally Posted by vpr80

That is actually a great comparison....too bad I can't get anywhere near either one....but if I do hit the lotto in the near future, I will enjoy my RM as I take the Zonda out for a spin :)

never say never bro :) hard work pays off

Originally Posted by patek.wis

I see them as the 'Franck muller' of this decade. Wait ten years and I don't think they'll be relevant. I'm sorry in advance but I truly believe this.
AP on the other hand. Awesome :)

i have heard this "franck muller of the decade" phrase a few times now and cannot gather what it means really :) FM makes some incredible movements and the styling and designs has its market. have their prices dropped significantly in the preowned mkt?!

RM started out with Massa in F1 but obviously the past 2yrs have not been a coincidence: Nadal, Watson, now Blake, and Manchester City football club .. all this marketing will just make the brand more desirable for more people who 'like cool' watches and not necessarily love watchmaking.
pretty sure we can agree a lot of the rolex/AP wearers are like that (no shame in that whatsoever) and this is what drives business

Originally Posted by Marrk

I like RM and look forward to learning more about them and seeing how they develop as a manufacture, if they do develop that way. Right now, they seem to have some interesting design ideas.

What's with the $6,000 minimum service fees? What is that about and can someone please provide something in the way of substantiation of this?

no idea about the $6k figure, and not sure what service is required
would be glad to learn more about this

[eric23]

I would love to get a RM but it will only happen if I win the lotto!

[kilyung]

Got the info from TZ owners... If I'm readin it correctly a RM11 would require $1300+3900=$5200? I guess the discontinued RM5 would be cheapest at $1300+$3000?

-----------------------------------
By Evitzee @TZ

RM Global Retail Service Pricing ...... Sun, 05 February 2012 20:37

This was just posted on the official Richard Mille website. They are introducing a unified price concept for the entire world so pricing will be the same no matter where you are. Pricing is in Swiss Francs. Save your centimes.

-----------------------------------


2012 RICHARD MILLE RETAIL SERVICE PRICING

Service Type Model Global Retail Price
Full Case Service incl polish* Automatics fr. 1 300
Full Case Service incl polish* Tourbillons fr. 2 200
Full Case Service incl polish* RM004/RM008 fr. 3 600

Full Mvmt Service incl polish** Automatics fr. 3 000
Full Mvmt Service incl polish** RM011/RM032 fr. 3 900

*
Dismantling of the case
Case opening = removing the glass, seals and pushers if present
Brushing case back, case band and bezel
Polishing of bevels (angles)
Remounting case
If necessary changing tube, crown, joints, glass and seals
Test seals for water resistance
Movement check
Case rebuilding, checking of all functions
Water resistance check
Assembly of the strap and reconditioning of the buckle

**
Reconditioning of the case
Removal of the dial and hands
Dismantling of the movement
Cleaning, oiling and rebuilding of the movement
Checkup and control
Assembly of the dial and hands
Checkup and control case rebuilt
Water resistance check
Assembly of the strap and reconditioning of the buckle

[Marrk]

SFr. 5200 = USD $5323.50

Yeah, I'd say that's pricey. But maybe you can't compare a Rolex RSC Service of $1500-$2000 on a Submariner to an RM $5323.50 service on one of those screw-plentiful tonneau-shaped cases with all the sapphire crystal inside and out . . . ?

[texex91]

Maybe its just me, but if u can afford RM, don't think any service cost is really a factor.

Could be wrong.

[TSW]

Originally Posted by texex91

Maybe its just me, but if u can afford RM, don't think any service cost is really a factor.

Could be wrong.

X2 gotta pay to play

And the service is less then 5k

[mrarchiegoodwin]

Did my reply post? Maybe not.

I went from AP to RM. Big differences in my experience.

AP service in Clearwater was so kind. I spoke to 3 staff there about fixing my old chronograph. It was fixed and returned to me beautifully packaged and with 5 pages of explanation and the old parts.

The RM AD in Beverly Hills (my town doesn't have an AD) was snooty (the opposite of the RM Boutique in Hong Kong) to me and acted as though it was a nuisance to send my watch (RM005 FM Ti) to the factory in Switzerland for service. I heard nothing for 6 weeks until the AD phoned and I arranged to have it mailed to me. It arrived in a big mailing box with no packing inside--just my Tupperware rolling around with the watch. No paperwork, no parts, no explanation. The watch was working again, but the attitude and lack of paperwork were disappointing. Not wanting to go through that again, I retired the watch to my sock drawer.

Another not so wonderful RM experience: I had to get a new band and the Carmel AD sold me 2 in different colors. Afterword I realized could not change the band myself. That requires RM tools that are not for sale.

[texex91]

Originally Posted by mrarchiegoodwin

Did my reply post? Maybe not.

I went from AP to RM. Big differences in my experience.

AP service in Clearwater was so kind. I spoke to 3 staff there about fixing my old chronograph. It was fixed and returned to me beautifully packaged and with 5 pages of explanation and the old parts.

The RM AD in Beverly Hills (my town doesn't have an AD) was snooty (the opposite of the RM Boutique in Hong Kong) to me and acted as though it was a nuisance to send my watch (RM005 FM Ti) to the factory in Switzerland for service. I heard nothing for 6 weeks until the AD phoned and I arranged to have it mailed to me. It arrived in a big mailing box with no packing inside--just my Tupperware rolling around with the watch. No paperwork, no parts, no explanation. The watch was working again, but the attitude and lack of paperwork were disappointing. Not wanting to go through that again, I retired the watch to my sock drawer.

Another not so wonderful RM experience: I had to get a new band and the Carmel AD sold me 2 in different colors. Afterword I realized could not change the band myself. That requires RM tools that are not for sale.

WOW. What a huge disappointment that must have been, after spending serious $$ on the watch.

Very glad to hear about the AP experience though

Clearwater seems to always exceed expecations, and is yet another reason to purchase AP products. You want a company that will take care of you AFTER the sale

[Marrk]

Originally Posted by mrarchiegoodwin

Did my reply post? Maybe not.

I went from AP to RM. Big differences in my experience.

AP service in Clearwater was so kind. I spoke to 3 staff there about fixing my old chronograph. It was fixed and returned to me beautifully packaged and with 5 pages of explanation and the old parts.

The RM AD in Beverly Hills (my town doesn't have an AD) was snooty (the opposite of the RM Boutique in Hong Kong) to me and acted as though it was a nuisance to send my watch (RM005 FM Ti) to the factory in Switzerland for service. I heard nothing for 6 weeks until the AD phoned and I arranged to have it mailed to me. It arrived in a big mailing box with no packing inside--just my Tupperware rolling around with the watch. No paperwork, no parts, no explanation. The watch was working again, but the attitude and lack of paperwork were disappointing. Not wanting to go through that again, I retired the watch to my sock drawer.

Another not so wonderful RM experience: I had to get a new band and the Carmel AD sold me 2 in different colors. Afterword I realized could not change the band myself. That requires RM tools that are not for sale.

That's most unfortunate. Shows very poor corporate culture, regardless of how good the watch itself may be. I am sorry to hear that.

So, "Clearwater" is Clearwater, Florida, perhaps? That's where the AP Service Center is?

[texex91]

Originally Posted by Marrk

So, "Clearwater" is Clearwater, Florida, perhaps? That's where the AP Service Center is?

Yes

[horseco]

I am sorry the RM looks cheap to me, like some Chinese franken watch. The AP, PP, Zenith ect. look the part of a handmade time piece.