Will Panerai pull itself from the deep abyss?

[Randy]

Seems like Panerai sales been underwater for quite some time. Will Panerai redeem itself? Or will they continue to produce way to many similar pieces and eventually become a sinking ship?

[Chaos]

It would be nice to get the numbers you are referring to -- where did you get them?

best

[nick c]

I think panerai doing very well this days

[Lgear080]

Yeah... You're wrong

[Rvltn123]

Just normal ebb and flow of the market. I don't mind this silly tactic of releasing all these variations of the same darn thing (terrible business strategy in my opinion). It means that consumers should really be able to find a model they like.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[Psmith]

Originally Posted by Randy

Seems like Panerai sales been underwater for quite some time. Will Panerai redeem itself? Or will they continue to produce way to many similar pieces and eventually become a sinking ship?

Do you have the sales data to support this?

[nick c]

Panerai 2015 Retail Pricelist


All Brands
PAM00270 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor 1950 10 Days GMT, PAM00270 PAM 270 $17,900
PAM00320 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor 1950 3 Days GMT Automatic, PAM00320 PAM 320 $10,500
PAM00329 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor 1950 3 Days GMT Automatic, PAM00329 PAM 329 $11,000
PAM00321 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor 1950 3 Days GMT Power Reserve Automatic, PAM00321 PAM 321 $10,800
PAM00347 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor 1950 3 Days GMT Power Reserve Automatic, PAM00347 PAM 347 $10,600
PAM00213 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor 1950 Rattrapante, PAM00213 PAM 213 $15,200
PAM00250 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Chrono Daylight, PAM00250 PAM 250 $8,700
PAM00356 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Chrono Daylight, PAM00356 PAM 356 $9,500
PAM00310 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Chronograph, PAM00310 PAM 310 $10,100
PAM00088 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor GMT, PAM00088 PAM 088 $9,100
PAM00244 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor GMT, PAM00244 PAM 244 $9,000
PAM00297 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor GMT, PAM00297 PAM 297 $9,400
PAM00351 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days Automatic Titanio, PAM00351 PAM 351 $9,400
PAM00352 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days Automatic Titanio, PAM00352 PAM 352 $10,200
PAM00312 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days Automatic, PAM00312 PAM 312 $9,100
PAM00328 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days Automatic, PAM00328 PAM 328 $9,500
PAM00359 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days Automatic, PAM00359 PAM 359 $9,200
PAM00283 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic Titanio, PAM00283 PAM 283 $9,600
PAM00048 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic, PAM00048 PAM 048 $8,100
PAM00049 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic, PAM00049 PAM 049 $8,100
PAM00051 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic, PAM00051 PAM 051 $7,900
PAM00104 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic, PAM00104 PAM 104 $8,300
PAM00164 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic, PAM00164 PAM 164 $8,300
PAM00298 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic, PAM00298 PAM 298 $8,800
PAM00299 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Marina Automatic, PAM00299 PAM 299 $9,000
PAM00090 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Power Reserve, PAM00090 PAM 090 $9,200
PAM00241 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Power Reserve, PAM00241 PAM 241 $9,100
PAM00305 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Submersible 1950 3 Days Automatic Titanio, PAM00305 PAM 305 $10,300
PAM00025 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Submersible Titanio, PAM00025 PAM 025 $9,100
PAM00024 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Luminor Submersible, PAM00024 PAM 024 $8,600
PAM00323 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Radiomir 10 Days GMT, PAM00323 PAM 323 $14,600
PAM00287 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Radiomir Black Seal Automatic, PAM00287 PAM 287 $8,100
PAM 00288 Officine Panerai: Contemporary Radiomir Chronograph, PAM00288 PAM 288 $9,200
PAM00372 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor 1950 3 Days, PAM00372 PAM 372 $11,200
PAM00289 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor 1950 8 Days GMT Oro Rosa, PAM00289 PAM 289 $34,500
PAM00233 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor 1950 8 Days GMT, PAM00233 PAM 233 $15,500
PAM00219 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Base Left-Handed, PAM00219 PAM 219 $7,300
PAM 00000 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Base Logo, PAM00000 PAM 000 $5,400
PAM00176 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Base Titanio, PAM00176 PAM 176 $7,600
PAM00112 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Base, PAM00112 PAM 112 $6,300
PAM00114 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Base, PAM00114 PAM 114 $7,000
PAM00005 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Marina Logo, PAM00005 PAM 005 $5,700
PAM00177 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Marina Titanio, PAM00177 PAM 177 $8,100
PAM00111 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Marina, PAM00111 PAM 111 $7,600
PAM00113 Officine Panerai: Historic Luminor Marina, PAM00113 PAM 113 $7,600
PAM00384 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir 8 Days Ceramica, PAM00384 PAM 384 $14,900
PAM00346 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir 8 Days Titanio, PAM00346 PAM 346 $14,800
PAM00292 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir Black Seal Ceramica, PAM00292 PAM 292 $10,200
PAM00380 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir Black Seal Logo, PAM00380 PAM 380 $5,100
PAM00183 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir Black Seal, PAM00183 PAM 183 $7,500
PAM00336 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir Oro Rosa, PAM00336 PAM 336 $20,400
PAM00378 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir Oro Rosa, PAM00378 PAM 378 $20,400
PAM00337 Officine Panerai: Historic Radiomir, PAM00337 PAM 337 $8,800
PAM00393 Officine Panerai: Luminor 1950 3 Days Automatic Oro Rosso, PAM00393 $26,600
PAM00423 Officine Panerai: Luminor 1950 3 Days Power Reserve, PAM00423 PAM 423 $11,300
PAM00396 Officine Panerai: Luminor 1950 Tourbillon GMT Ceramica, PAM00396 $136,600
PAM00392 Officine Panerai: Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days Automatic, PAM00392 $8,800
PAM00438 Officine Panerai: Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days GMT Automatic Ceramica, PAM00438 $16,800
PAM00441 Officine Panerai: Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days GMT Automatic Ceramica, PAM00441 $13,200
PAM00422 Officine Panerai: Luminor Marina 1950 3 Days, PAM00422 PAM 422 $11,500
PAM00421 Officine Panerai: Radiomir 3 Days Gmt Oro Rosso, PAM00421 PAM 421 $27,000
PAM00388 Officine Panerai: Radiomir Black Seal 3 Days Automatic, PAM00388 PAM 388 $8,800
PAM00424 Officine Panerai: Radiomir California 3 Days, PAM00424 $9,200
PAM00439 Officine Panerai: Radiomir Oro Rosso, PAM00439 $21,800
PAM00425 Officine Panerai: Radiomir S.L.C. 3 Days, PAM00425 $9,200
PAM00210 Officine Panerai: Radiomir, PAM00210 $7,000
PAM 00376 Officine Panerai: Special Edition 2011 Radiomir 3 Days Oro Bianco, PAM00376 PAM 376 $29,900
PAM00379 Officine Panerai: Special Edition 2011 Radiomir 3 Days Oro Rosa, PAM00379 PAM 379 $36,800
PAM00373 Officine Panerai: Special Edition 2011 Radiomir 3 Days Platino, PAM00373 PAM 373 $48,000
PAM00317 Officine Panerai: Specialities Luminor 1950 Chrono Monopulsante 8 Days GMT Ceramica, PAM00317 PAM 317 $26,100
PAM00311 Officine Panerai: Specialities Luminor 1950 Chrono Monopulsante 8 Days GMT Titanio, PAM00311 PAM 311 $21,900
PAM00275 Officine Panerai: Specialities Luminor 1950 Chrono Monopulsante 8 Days GMT, PAM00275 PAM 275 $19,900
PAM00319 Officine Panerai: Specialities Luminor 1950 Rattrapante 8 Days Oro Rosa, PAM00319 PAM 319 $46,500

[Watch This]

Resale has softened but I don't subscribe to the gloom and doom prognosis. Sorry.

[Randy]

No gloom and doom here. Obvious Panerai sales are way off, most ADs won't admit this fact. I have numerous relationships with Dealers all over the world. Most agree sales are way down on Panerai compared to Rolex and other brands. Resale values have also dropped substantially.

[kilyung]

I haven't seen any sales reports to indicate that Panerai sales have ebbed and even so as long as they are making models people want to buy does it really matter?

[1William]

As a former Paneresti I can tell you that many of the original owners that I know have diversified their collections and while many still love the brand many are shaking their heads at the marketing strategy. If you want to see what that community is like go to Paneresti.com and see how few posts and read there take on it. Some very strong thoughts and statements about the brand by longtime followers.

[Cru Jones]

AFAIK, they've never sold more than 50k/year, if that, and boutiques continue to open, not close.

Anyway, I wear watches I like, not sales figures or fabricated internet gossip.

[mfer]

The days of super hot models over asking price are over. People have learned that it isn't a stock anymore. People also realized that Panerai at any point will release a model almost exactly like the one they have that is hot. It has made people more apprehensive to dishing out big bucks for the hot ones.

I still like Panerai a lot, and would love them if they would improve their service experience. Also, if you are going to have display backs, make your movements better. Seriously the cote de geneve ETA 6497 looks better than a P 2002.

[Psmith]

Originally Posted by Randy

No gloom and doom here. Obvious Panerai sales are way off, most ADs won't admit this fact. I have numerous relationships with Dealers all over the world. Most agree sales are way down on Panerai compared to Rolex and other brands. Resale values have also dropped substantially.

How would they know - Rolex don't release sales figures. The two cannot be compared anyway, as Rolex are a far bigger operation. How is it obvious that sales are 'way off'? (vague term)

Without hard numbers this is just gossip, as Cru says.

[subtona]

Originally Posted by mfer

The days of super hot models over asking price are over. People have learned that it isn't a stock anymore. People also realized that Panerai at any point will release a model almost exactly like the one they have that is hot. It has made people more apprehensive to dishing out big bucks for the hot ones.

I still like Panerai a lot, and would love them if they would improve their service experience. Also, if you are going to have display backs, make your movements better. Seriously the cote de geneve ETA 6497 looks better than a P 2002.

Well said

I'll add put a steel case back on all of them, nothing to see back there

[B. Doggy]

I still like Panerai, but will only have one in my collection.

[Watch This]

Originally Posted by mfer

The days of super hot models over asking price are over. People have learned that it isn't a stock anymore. People also realized that Panerai at any point will release a model almost exactly like the one they have that is hot. It has made people more apprehensive to dishing out big bucks for the hot ones.

I still like Panerai a lot, and would love them if they would improve their service experience. Also, if you are going to have display backs, make your movements better. Seriously the cote de geneve ETA 6497 looks better than a P 2002.

I agree with every word. 422 owner here.

[kilyung]

Originally Posted by subtona

I'll add put a steel case back on all of them, nothing to see back there

And easier to hide rough movements.

[Cru Jones]

Originally Posted by subtona

Well said

I'll add put a steel case back on all of them, nothing to see back there

Originally Posted by kilyung

And easier to hide rough movements.

while true that for me, panerai "should" be a solid back, just like rolex, OP continues to refine the movement (& show it off).....




(just announced on p.com)

[zacharyjames]

where is the proof of the "abyss?"

Boutiques are everywhere, their marketing is going strong.

I love the threads with absolutely no factual support whatsoever, and which border on slander, designed to drum up controversy.

[Jiggo]

No idea about their sales figures but honestly? It's the buyers market now!!!
Have been a ristis for almost 6 years but no idea what really happened???
All the second hand prices are coming way downnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn
For instance
Pre-V 201a nice and complete 40K then now 30K
9A 20K now 15K
36MM from 33K now 23-25K
372 now 6K
232 now 6K
249 from 12-13K now 9K
Fiddy 20K now 15K
plus a bunch of other models so like I said, they are now at more AFFORDABLE price
and truly a BUYERS' market now!
but hey still a paneristi for life!

[masterserg]

Originally Posted by mfer

The days of super hot models over asking price are over. People have learned that it isn't a stock anymore. People also realized that Panerai at any point will release a model almost exactly like the one they have that is hot. It has made people more apprehensive to dishing out big bucks for the hot ones.

I still like Panerai a lot, and would love them if they would improve their service experience. Also, if you are going to have display backs, make your movements better. Seriously the cote de geneve ETA 6497 looks better than a P 2002.

I like the 2002!

The 9000/9001 on the other hand ....

[red1108nyc]

Originally Posted by subtona

Well said

I'll add put a steel case back on all of them, nothing to see back there

Gus,

The "nothing to see back there" part cracked me up... great stuff haha!!

Hope all is well friend!

Fred

[redsubby]

No special attachment to this brand, the 005 is enough PAM for me.

[jvo300]

Local AD told me that Panerai was just not selling anymore. It's just one data point and proves nothing, but I was quite surprised to hear it.

[MP5]

Nope they went away from their fanatics and to date there are the historics and a few known others. All the rest in the past 5 years are beached whales.

[zacharyjames]

Good. More for me

[tomcorkery]

Not sure about the abyss, but my 372 has taken a very big hit. Still love them and as the price goes down I will add others. Sold off my 243 and 210 for about what I paid for them. Took a 3k loss on my 233 dot dial. Would love to pick up a 9 with luminova if the price is right or a 28L.

[cervantes]

Panerai still very strong in Europe. I agree, the days of the special and limited editions that fetched huge sums are over. If there has been a drop off in sales I don't see it being much different than the industry as a whole. Panerai has carved themselves out a useful niche in the market. And whiles they could be seen as a one-trick pony, they execute their one trick very well.

[GermanyMatt]

Panerai might be strong in Italy, but it's certainly not strong across Europe. That would be Rolex.
I had a 312 a few years ago - loved it at first, but the affection wore off over time. It happens. Certainly seems to be a buyer's market right now, as Panerai aren't holding their value very well right now. Times change though. But if you buy and plan to keep, I don't see why an owner would care. I think we all know that Rolex is about the only brand that consistently holds its value well, and that's only the SS sports models. Panerai is becoming a bit like Breitling IMO.