Tesla Stock

[superdog]

I have seen some of the comments back and forth from you guys, and some of you really appear to know what you are doing.

I am curious what you guys think about Tesla. I love what the company is doing and would really like to jump on board. It is not cheap, but I have to imagine these guys are just going to keep innovating and growing.

Besides, their cars are simply the highest rated car ever at this point. I can't imagine it is not a safe bet.

With them now trying to change how we use energy, I feel like they could absolutely explode.

Any thoughts?

[mannyv11]

I can honestly say I am very interested in the technology that they revealed yesterday.
With that being said I can't really afford a Tesla car but the price point for this new tech and the way it could potentially be used could be a real game changer in the next 5-10 years.

Musk made a very good point especially in undeveloped countries being able to use it since there are no real grids set up yet in those regions.

with that being said I really could see this technology changing our we use our power grid, and with a lot of people being concerned with climate change etc I think this is the perfect time for tesla to introduce this type of tech.

[Danny83]

Tesla is a great way to invest http://www.theverge.com/2015/5/1/852...ockstar-savior , I would not think twice looks like this is going to be big.

[superdog]

Great points Manny, and that is what I am thinking.

At $225, can it really go up that far? Can money be made from buying this stock?

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Danny83

Tesla is a great way to invest http://www.theverge.com/2015/5/1/852...ockstar-savior , I would not think twice looks like this is going to be big.

great. article.

thank you,

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by superdog

Great points Manny, and that is what I am thinking.

At $225, can it really go up that far? Can money be made from buying this stock?

a lot of people said the same thing about apple at 100 then 300, then 500 then 700 then the 7/1 split, and not its back in the 120's highs of 134 i think on thursday.

Musk is truly the real deal tony stark, hopefully we are all flying around in personalized iron man armor in the next 10-15 years haha.

I do see the stock really going up especially because word on the street is that over the next couple of years a 30,000 dollar tesla car is supposed to make an appearance which could be even bigger than the other models.

if i could swing the price tag of that stock i would without a doubt.

[Pix]

When i read speculation with what he wants to do to get homes off the grid with an alternate power source, and if he can apply that to what he has done with the car, I would think he could be the next Steve Jobs.

[Kingair]

Stock jumped 20 % . . .

[tkerrmd]

not sure about buying the stock but probably getting there solar powered home battery!

[69mach351]

Originally Posted by Pix

When i read speculation with what he wants to do to get homes off the grid with an alternate power source, and if he can apply that to what he has done with the car, I would think he could be the next Steve Jobs.

I would argue that what he is doing/attempting/may do, is a lot bigger than Jobs. Just my opinion though. I could see it being argued.

[SrFADE]

Depends on what you want out of your portfolio. Currently, TSLA is a speculative stock; negative earnings, negative profit margin, negative ROE, negative ROA, negative ROC, basically no investment fundamentals. If you like gambling, great time to buy. Book value is just over $7.00 per share vs. market price of $220 per share. The "Tesla Energy" hype is just that. Solar energy capture and storage in battery sets is ancient technology, Tesla has just substituted Lithium Ion for Lead Acid. Full manufacturing stream for Li Ion batteries has its own set of environmental problems. I have my money placed elsewhere and am perfectly happy missing a potential speculative run-up of this company. The comparison to Steve Jobs is laughable. Jobs actually designed and profitably sold products. Musk has a long way to go to reach that objective.

[cornerstore]

Musk says the stock is overvalued ,he should know. Its high on short squeeze not fundamentals .

[cornerstore]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

Depends on what you want out of your portfolio. Currently, TSLA is a speculative stock; negative earnings, negative profit margin, negative ROE, negative ROA, negative ROC, basically no investment fundamentals. If you like gambling, great time to buy. Book value is just over $7.00 per share vs. market price of $220 per share. The "Tesla Energy" hype is just that. Solar energy capture and storage in battery sets is ancient technology, Tesla has just substituted Lithium Ion for Lead Acid. Full manufacturing stream for Li Ion batteries has its own set of environmental problems. I have my money placed elsewhere and am perfectly happy missing a potential speculative run-up of this company. The comparison to Steve Jobs is laughable. Jobs actually designed and profitably sold products. Musk has a long way to go to reach that objective.

Jobs "designed ", I think not , he employed designers in house and out. Jobs was the PT Barnum of tech. As far as profits, he lost a lot of money in the early days of Apple, then got fired. Little known fact, he had little skin in the Apple company, his wealth came from Pixar not Apple. We won't get into his humanity or lack there of.

[SrFADE]

Originally Posted by cornerstore

Jobs "designed ", I think not , he employed designers in house and out. Jobs was the PT Barnum of tech. As far as profits, he lost a lot of money in the early days of Apple, then got fired. Little know fact, he had little skin in the Apple company, his wealth came from Pixar not Apple. We won't get into his humanity or lack there of.

Jobs = Apple Cook is going to have his head handed to him because of his clear inability to drive/inspire/scare his teams to produce great products.

I seriously doubt Musk is down in the CAD room "designing" his overpriced/huckster promoted products either.

[nocrown]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

Depends on what you want out of your portfolio. Currently, TSLA is a speculative stock; negative earnings, negative profit margin, negative ROE, negative ROA, negative ROC, basically no investment fundamentals. If you like gambling, great time to buy. Book value is just over $7.00 per share vs. market price of $220 per share. The "Tesla Energy" hype is just that. Solar energy capture and storage in battery sets is ancient technology, Tesla has just substituted Lithium Ion for Lead Acid. Full manufacturing stream for Li Ion batteries has its own set of environmental problems. I have my money placed elsewhere and am perfectly happy missing a potential speculative run-up of this company. The comparison to Steve Jobs is laughable. Jobs actually designed and profitably sold products. Musk has a long way to go to reach that objective.

correct. not a single (gaap) profitable quarter to date (like amazon). and given current tech, a tesla burns more fossil fuels per mile traveled than regular car...

the ponzi "market" pushing all time highs is only due to central banks pumping 22 TRILLION in "assets" since 2008 into this thing with over 70mos of ZIRP here in Merika and bunds going neg... think about what you are "investing" in.... LOL

[nocrown]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

Jobs = Apple Cook is going to have his head handed to him because of his clear inability to drive/inspire/scare his teams to produce great products.

I seriously doubt Musk is down in the CAD room "designing" his overpriced/huckster promoted products either.

the voice of reason here -- i am totally shocked i'd be reading this in a Rolex forum¡¡¡¡ pleasantly surprised. and oh crAAPL is beyond overpriced as stock and totally decoupled from fundamentals, the upcoming tax scandal notwithstanding...

[azguy]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

Depends on what you want out of your portfolio. Currently, TSLA is a speculative stock; negative earnings, negative profit margin, negative ROE, negative ROA, negative ROC, basically no investment fundamentals. If you like gambling, great time to buy. Book value is just over $7.00 per share vs. market price of $220 per share. The "Tesla Energy" hype is just that............

well said

[cornerstore]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

Jobs = Apple Cook is going to have his head handed to him because of his clear inability to drive/inspire/scare his teams to produce great products.

I seriously doubt Musk is down in the CAD room "designing" his overpriced/huckster promoted products either.

I'll give you that, Jobs was a bully who scared people. Tesla freely opens its patents to others, how is Apple doing in that regard.

[SrFADE]

Originally Posted by cornerstore

I'll give you that, Jobs was a bully who scared people. Tesla freely opens its patents to others, how is Apple doing in that regard.

Doesn't matter. This started as a business/investing discussion, not a comparison of perceived or real philanthropy on the part of a corporation. As a shareholder in a company, I expect a return on my investment - either long term or short term, depending on what part of the portfolio it resides in. Frankly, I expect the company that I invest in, to do what's best for the shareholders - if that means keeping control of the patents that were generated from the capital I provided to the company, then so be it. I leave philanthropy up to the organizations to which I provide contributions for those stated purposes.

[cornerstore]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

Doesn't matter. This started as a business/investing discussion, not a comparison of perceived or real philanthropy on the part of a corporation. As a shareholder in a company, I expect a return on my investment - either long term or short term, depending on what part of the portfolio it resides in. Frankly, I expect the company that I invest in, to do what's best for the shareholders - if that means keeping control of the patents that were generated from the capital I provided to the company, then so be it. I leave philanthropy up to the organizations to which I provide contributions for those stated purposes.

Like the Ford foundation, the Rockefeller foundation, the Rolex foundation and others corporate foundations that built and equipped the great cities many of us reside in today ,and who see fit to give back/invest in those who buy their products. Capitalism is more than hoarding cash. Buying stock does not make you a provider of capital to the company, unless it was seed stock. Read your history , great companies are more than great products.

[nocrown]

Originally Posted by cornerstore

Like the Ford foundation, the Rockefeller foundation, the Rolex foundation and others corporate foundations that built and equipped the great cities many of us reside in today ,and who see fit to give back to those who buy their products. Capitalism is more than hoarding cash. Buying stock does not make you a provider of capital to the company, unless it was seed stock. Read your history , great companies are more than great products.

in 2015 there is mostly only crony-capitalism. corp buybacks, (global) QE and ZIRP are what is holding this ponzi together....

true capitalism is a beautiful thing, but we do not have that in the USSA; in fact, the birth rate of new biz has been overtaken by death rate of biz...i could go on, but i suspect most would prefer to njoy their rolex and sip kool-aide..

[Laszlo]

I think there are two things working against Tesla right now. They have new competition, coming out of Germany. And the Tesla Model S needs a major design refresh. It's seemingly been out forever. And it's getting dated. Personally, I wouldn't buy because the captital required to navigate around just these two factors is extremely high.

[SrFADE]

Originally Posted by cornerstore

Like the Ford foundation, the Rockefeller foundation, the Rolex foundation and others corporate foundations that built and equipped the great cities many of us reside in today ,and who see fit to give back to those who buy their products. Capitalism is more than hoarding cash. Buying stock does not make you a provider of capital to the company, unless it was seed stock. Read your history , great companies are more than great products.

I don't need anybody chastising my grip on history. You are correct that "hoarding cash" is not capitalism - in fact, it is exactly the opposite. Businesses are doing that as a result of uncertainty - uncertainty of tax policy, social policy, political instability, etc. In this environment of government interference with true capitalism, we will continue to see these abuses of the best financial structure that exists. If you think that buying stock is not providing capital benefit to the originating business, then you need to read some business books. Yes, once issued and sold, a stock transaction is between two shareholders. However, it provides valuation for future issuances which, in turn, boosts the capital available to the company. The originating company continues to capitalize itself through that new valuation.
I've participated in enough IPOs as well as the receipt of founders stock to have a pretty good feel for how this works.
That being said, and back to the original question, no, I would not invest in Tesla and I am perfectly comfortable missing any potential upside in a fundamentally flawed business model.

[RollieVerde]

Toyota has a hydrogen powered car that consumers will be able to buy later this year for under $50K. You refuel it like a regular car at a refilling station in about 5 minutes, every 300 miles or so. Hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe, and even cattle crap can be used for fuel. There is no battery; electric power is developed on board and the H tanks are bomb proof. Very interesting technology, and all it needs is the infrastructure which will take a few years. Food for thought.

[cornerstore]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

I don't need anybody chastising my grip on history. You are correct that "hoarding cash" is not capitalism - in fact, it is exactly the opposite. Businesses are doing that as a result of uncertainty - uncertainty of tax policy, social policy, political instability, etc. In this environment of government interference with true capitalism, we will continue to see these abuses of the best financial structure that exists. If you think that buying stock is not providing capital benefit to the originating business, then you need to read some business books. Yes, once issued and sold, a stock transaction is between two shareholders. However, it provides valuation for future issuances which, in turn, boosts the capital available to the company. The originating company continues to capitalize itself through that new valuation.
I've participated in enough IPOs as well as the receipt of founders stock to have a pretty good feel for how this works.
That being said, and back to the original question, no, I would not invest in Tesla and I am perfectly comfortable missing any potential upside in a fundamentally flawed business model.

"However, it provides valuation for future issuances which, in turn, boosts the capital available to the company"
When was the last time Apple went back to the public markets for an infusion of cash , we were speaking about Apple were we not?

If you are only bottom line oriented and not interested in the whole of a companies worth then yes You are investing in the right company that's for sure. Apple http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/24/bu...-pay.html?_r=0

Tesla http://www.valuewalk.com/2015/04/tes...ory-employees/

OBTW, You took the first personal shot, Musk vs the dead guy. "Chastising" is a little bit of an exaggeration , suggesting that one to look back on history is trying to make one aware of ones past, so as to better understand ones future,end of discussion.

[Knappo 1307]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

I don't need anybody chastising my grip on history. You are correct that "hoarding cash" is not capitalism - in fact, it is exactly the opposite. Businesses are doing that as a result of uncertainty - uncertainty of tax policy, social policy, political instability, etc. In this environment of government interference with true capitalism, we will continue to see these abuses of the best financial structure that exists. If you think that buying stock is not providing capital benefit to the originating business, then you need to read some business books. Yes, once issued and sold, a stock transaction is between two shareholders. However, it provides valuation for future issuances which, in turn, boosts the capital available to the company. The originating company continues to capitalize itself through that new valuation.
I've participated in enough IPOs as well as the receipt of founders stock to have a pretty good feel for how this works.
That being said, and back to the original question, no, I would not invest in Tesla and I am perfectly comfortable missing any potential upside in a fundamentally flawed business model.

I like this guy....

[nocrown]

Originally Posted by SrFADE

I don't need anybody chastising my grip on history. You are correct that "hoarding cash" is not capitalism - in fact, it is exactly the opposite. Businesses are doing that as a result of uncertainty - uncertainty of tax policy, social policy, political instability, etc. In this environment of government interference with true capitalism, we will continue to see these abuses of the best financial structure that exists. If you think that buying stock is not providing capital benefit to the originating business, then you need to read some business books. Yes, once issued and sold, a stock transaction is between two shareholders. However, it provides valuation for future issuances which, in turn, boosts the capital available to the company. The originating company continues to capitalize itself through that new valuation.
I've participated in enough IPOs as well as the receipt of founders stock to have a pretty good feel for how this works.
That being said, and back to the original question, no, I would not invest in Tesla and I am perfectly comfortable missing any potential upside in a fundamentally flawed business model.

like a central bank (both private and quasi-public) setting interest rates (at near zero, more at nirp inflation adjusted) and issuing since 08' officially nearly 4 trill (more on shadow books) in QE ... that is capitalism¿¿¿¿¿ LOL

and buybacks w/ said free money is capitalism¿¿¿

Shiller PE ratio and the fast approaching 3 sigma on the S&P should make u run for the exits.....

oh and just from bloomberg right now: Auto Sales Drop biggest year-to-date since.......2009.

[SrFADE]

Originally Posted by cornerstore

"However, it provides valuation for future issuances which, in turn, boosts the capital available to the company"
When was the last time Apple went back to the public markets for an infusion of cash , we are speaking about Apple were we not?
If you are only bottom line oriented and not interested in the whole of a companies worth then yes You are investing in the right company that's for sure. Apple http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/24/bu...-pay.html?_r=0

Tesla http://www.valuewalk.com/2015/04/tes...ory-employees/

No, we were not speaking about Apple. I was speaking bout my investments in general. I have been out of AAPL for quite some time, and yes, I missed the last 20% but you know what, I still made money - good money. Apple doesn't need to reissue because, surprise, they actually are profitable as opposed to TSLA. I own Apple products, I use Apple products, but I no longer own any Apple stock (at least directly, there is some in a couple of my Mutual Funds.) Regardless, I evaluate each purchase, product or equity, on its usefulness to me, not on who or what the company represents socially and I take care of my social contributions directly.

[nocrown]

if ur considering TSLA, then i think u should go all in UNCRN (unicorn). ..

[brandrea]

I view these companies as more of a speculative investment and it would only represent a very small holding % in my portfolio. Nothing wrong with it I suppose, but high beta stocks can be very volatile.

I guess it all depends on what type of investment you are after.