Parmigiani - Under-appreciated??

[conkers]

Am I losing the plot, or is this a pretty decent looking watch?

[PJ S]

Ah…the Tonda Chronor Anniversaire – haven’t seen it in the metal, but from all other accounts, it certainly does look to be an absolute belter.
Lovely partially skeletonised movement, 36K vph high beat, and the dials are grand feu enamel, iirc.
Rattrapante (split seconds) too, but even with only 25 pieces each in RG and WG, residual will likely be comparable to AL&S – so buying at the right price is paramount.

Loved their video, when I first saw it – almost enough of a reason in itself to make you want to buy the watch!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG8Foi56s34

http://blog.parmigiani.ch/content/to...ed-chronograph




http://professionalwatches.com/2016/...sihh-2016.html
http://www.houseofchronos.com/brands...h-anniversary/

[goog53]

Very cool watch. Not nitpicking just curious... Why does the strap attach so far away from the end of the lugs? I realize you don't want a gap between the strap and case but wonder if a strap with a curved end would've been a better design for the shape of the case

[mps354]

Originally Posted by conkers

Am I losing the plot, or is this a pretty decent looking watch?

Love the color combo

[ELITEVIDEOGAMES]

It's a nice looking watch. Not crazy about the half moon seconds display.
Out of curiosity what type of pricing are we talking ?
I seriously wonder how some of these smaller brands survive , how many watches a year do they sell?

[rootbeer7]

Their watches and this one particularly are beautiful. 2nd hand they're amazing value. some models 75% off. Been eyeing up a gold Pershing Chrono at silly money (unfortunately funds being used elsewhere!)

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by ELITEVIDEOGAMES

It's a nice looking watch. Not crazy about the half moon seconds display.
Out of curiosity what type of pricing are we talking ?
I seriously wonder how some of these smaller brands survive , how many watches a year do they sell?

$135K
Survival isn't just down to output, they provide services, and parts and movements to other brands.
Val Fleurier Manufacture is the movements division, and a comment in one of the linked articles states their dial division does work for AL&S.
The base movement of a Bvlgari Octo Solotempo is the VFM3000, similarly that in the Bathyscaphe Diver (not to be confused with Blancpain's Bathyscaphe).

[dchang81]

They have a few good looking watches and beautiful finishing. But most of them to me are pretty ugly. Wouldn't mind a simple tonda dress watch

[soundserious]

Most are hideous, truly ugly; but this one is quite lovely.

[bdex75]

That particular model is lovely. But at that price I am buying a PP simply for the resale. If I was looking at it used at 75% off, maybe.


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[conkers]

Thanks for the comments.

A lot of watch for the money for the reasons mentioned, if it was a Patek, it would be 400k.

Can't find any used ones, but I doubt they would be 75% off. Other Parmigiani models yes, this is true but I imagine not this one.

[kilyung]

Ive never been a big fan of Parmi styling. From what I have observed, their residual value is terrible and discounts are so-so.

[lapince]

My Rolex AD in Paris carries them and I have yet to see a decent one, most are quite ugly, but I must say that this one seems nice, except the lug/strap thing which is a little strange but not a deal breaker...

[conkers]

Ask Camille Fournet to provide a curved strap and all sorted!

[ELITEVIDEOGAMES]

Originally Posted by PJ S

$135K
Survival isn't just down to output, they provide services, and parts and movements to other brands.
Val Fleurier Manufacture is the movements division, and a comment in one of the linked articles states their dial division does work for AL&S.
The base movement of a Bvlgari Octo Solotempo is the VFM3000, similarly that in the Bathyscaphe Diver (not to be confused with Blancpain's Bathyscaphe).

So they do a lot of stuff behind the scenes, makes sense.
Thats incredible if they do dial work for AL&S seeing as they are not part of Richemont. I wish good fortune on all watch companies as I believe competition creates greatness so I hope they stick around, they wont be getting my money though.

[incontrol]

Is the Bathyscape diver you are talking about an Aquadive 500? I have one and it is a great watch with a Fleurier movement.

[Flex368]

Originally Posted by conkers

Am I losing the plot, or is this a pretty decent looking watch?

You´re not, it´s very nice watch.

Rose gold with blue dial is just...

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by incontrol

Is the Bathyscape diver you are talking about an Aquadive 500? I have one and it is a great watch with a Fleurier movement.

That's the one.

[incontrol]

Fleurier movement in the Aquadive.

[TickTock1950]

Saw a stainless Kapla XL last year that was new offered at below $5000. The seller had two, one graphite dial, one white dial. Loved them both but funds were not available at the time. I loved the turtle leg lugs (for lack of a better term). I was looking at it to fill the role of a tank watch. Still wish I would have found a way to buy it. If memory serves me right it was roughly 50% off retail.

[jhcam8]

Parmigiana makes some beautiful pieces, but, like Jacques Droz, if you buy at retail - even with a normal dealer discount - you will lose your ass if you sell or trade.

[masyv6]

Originally Posted by soundserious

Most are hideous, truly ugly; but this one is quite lovely.

I agree. I can't stand most of the brand, but this one is good.

[conkers]

None on sale that I can find sadly.

[KarlS]

Kari Voutilainen was a by product of the brand I think

[lapince]

This one for a PT chrono is quite nice and very cheap

https://www.chrono24.com/en/parmigia...-id4053390.htm

[tigerpac]

Originally Posted by KarlS

Kari Voutilainen was a by product of the brand I think

He was.

I don't love all their designs but do think they're underappreciated for what they do.

[massimo.]

Parmigiani market positioning is a nonsense. Watches of superb quality, but too many models and too much low street price. They have to downsize both the number of models and the official retail price, but keep firm (imho)

[Nav01L]

To the original question, I would say no. Parmigiani is a brillant restaurator and those who need him in that capacity appreciate him for it. And then there is the slightly artificial effort to graft a brand onto that… which has, as of yet, not gained much traction. In my view the reason for that is not the quality of what they do, which is not at the highest of levels but good enough. It’s the lack of passion for making watches, when what they really want and know how to do is repair them in 70 years. That leads to a broadly uninspired by the book collection, which does not have a sufficiently distinct character for collectors to grip onto.

As a result, they are rated just about right I would say.

[Nav01L]

Originally Posted by PJ S

$135K
Survival isn't just down to output, they provide services, and parts and movements to other brands.
Val Fleurier Manufacture is the movements division, and a comment in one of the linked articles states their dial division does work for AL&S.
The base movement of a Bvlgari Octo Solotempo is the VFM3000, similarly that in the Bathyscaphe Diver (not to be confused with Blancpain's Bathyscaphe).

I think you are confusing something, Valfleurier is part of Richemont and does about every „in house“ movement for brands like Panerai and IWC below a certain price point.

I believe what you are referring to is Vaucher Manufacture, which I believe is a JV between them and Hermès.

[AperolSpritz]

Originally Posted by PJ S

$135K
Survival isn't just down to output, they provide services, and parts and movements to other brands.
Val Fleurier Manufacture is the movements division, and a comment in one of the linked articles states their dial division does work for AL&S.
The base movement of a Bvlgari Octo Solotempo is the VFM3000, similarly that in the Bathyscaphe Diver (not to be confused with Blancpain's Bathyscaphe).

I would generally agree with that but unfortunately not for Parmigiani.

Parmigiani has been bleeding cash for ever and probably never been even break-even.

The reason why they are still out there is because they are owned and supported by the Sandoz foundation (Sandoz family made a fortune in pharmaceuticals).

The brand is loosing like CHF20m a year...

And even the Sandoz family want to stop this. They are reportedly looking for a buyer.

Never been a great fan though some models are ok. But the uncertainty about the brand in the future is in any case a major issue for me.