Annoying situation with AP

[mbalmz]

apologies in advance for the long post--just curious what (if anything) people would do in this situation.

so I received my first AP (brand new from AD) earlier this year and love the watch. after a couple of months I find that the movement now stops literally 2 hours after I take it off. so I take it to AP and they service the watch. they tell me the oils have dried prematurely so it needs a full service. annoying for a brand new watch but ok.

comes back a couple of weeks later (expedited given it was a warranty service and so soon after the original purchase, which I appreciated), and after picking up the watch I notice there's a mark on the bezel that wasn't there before. not a scratch or a dent really, but an opaque "scuff-like" mark on the polished bit of the bezel that looks like a smudge you'll just be able to wipe off (but can't).

so I'm pretty annoyed at this point (more than I was initially) and I take it back and let them know the issue. they say they take photos and video of every watch they service and they'll check to make sure the mark wasn't there when I gave them the watch--and I'm grateful for the evidence since I know the mark wasn't there before. they check the video and tell me they "cannot really tell" from the video if the mark was there before so it's "my word against theirs", but "the customer is always right" in that case so they'll take the watch in again to fix the smudge. I guess that's a win but it honestly made me feel a bit crappy and like I was obliquely/impliedly/maybe getting accused of lying about the mark.

so then they e-mail me and tell me they are confident they can get the mark out without polishing/refinishing the whole watch (which I told them I absolutely don't want), but they'll need to take it apart again and run through quality control a second time.

assuming all goes well I'll have the watch back in a few weeks and hopefully looking the way it did when I gave it to them, so a part of me feels like I shouldn't be complaining (what else are they supposed to do for me, after all). but at the same time this is a brand new watch, my first from the brand and one that has sentimental value for unrelated reasons--and this experience/being without my watch for what will probably be 6-8 weeks total is really leaving a sour taste in my mouth.

am I being dramatic/should I just be grateful they're fixing the watch? would people do/say anything else in my situation?

thanks in advance.

[Gravity]

Given the two issues I'd press for new watch at this point. You are absolutely not out of line for not accepting subpar performance or damage from AP. Keep us posted.

[Burlington]

The incoming camera system they have is very comprehensive but perhaps placement or angle made it difficult to see.

It’s not great of course that this has happened but I do think rolling with it and maybe asking for a gesture of goodwill would be the best solution given that watches sentimental value to you.

[pepsiretail]

No, I don't think you are being dramatic. There was an issue with the mechanism on a new watch, not something I would expect but it does happen. After you pointed out the scuff that really should have been enough, imho, for them rather than resorting to video review. I'm sure it is annoying to wait and I hope the dealer has shared their sympathies. Good luck for when it is returned.

[AK797]

Not great for sure but I'd just let it play out, 6 weeks is not bad when you consider a PP could easily be three times that long, try to stay positive.

[GB-man]

That’s annoying would have been nice if they just said send it in and we will fix it. Sorry about that.

Anyways glad it’s being taken care of. Patek returned my nautilus without a minute marker in a very similar situation so you’re not alone lol

[mbalmz]

thanks all--appreciate the input. I guess it may not be worth saying anything/making more of a stink now while they're trying to get this scuff off the bezel but thinking it may be worth at least registering my disillusionment when I pick it up.

[mbalmz]

Originally Posted by Burlington

The incoming camera system they have is very comprehensive but perhaps placement or angle made it difficult to see.

It’s not great of course that this has happened but I do think rolling with it and maybe asking for a gesture of goodwill would be the best solution given that watches sentimental value to you.

makes sense--assuming they fix this thing to my satisfaction (lord knows it will be a bigger issue if there's something new wrong with it), any thought/idea as to what a gesture of goodwill would be in this situation?

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by mbalmz

… so I take it to AP and they service the watch. they tell me the oils have dried prematurely so it needs a full service. annoying for a brand new watch but ok.

...

Complete and utter bollocks!
Your mainspring broke, more than likely.

As for their comprehensive camera system – must be crap resolution if they can’t see what the eye of the person inspecting the watch should’ve seen and noted.
Given they haven’t, then it’s safe to assume they marked the bezel, and whomever has been speaking with you is making it out that they’re doing you a favour… along with the veiled insinuation that you are claiming for something you did yourself!
Doesn’t exactly give you a lot of faith in their QC routine, does it?

[mbalmz]

Originally Posted by PJ S

Complete and utter bollocks!
Your mainspring broke, more than likely.

As for their comprehensive camera system – must be crap resolution if they can’t see what the eye of the person inspecting the watch should’ve seen and noted.
Given they haven’t, then it’s safe to assume they marked the bezel, and whomever has been speaking with you is making it out that they’re doing you a favour… along with the veiled insinuation that you are claiming for something you did yourself!
Doesn’t exactly give you a lot of faith in their QC routine, does it?

well the watch would still get going via the crown after it stopped, and it still wound automatically as I wore it (i.e. I'd wear it all day long without it stopping), it would just stop quite quickly after I took it off for the day--that doesn't seem like a broken mainspring does it?

as to QC--you're unfortunately quite correct.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by mbalmz

well the watch would still get going via the crown after it stopped, and it still wound automatically as I wore it (i.e. I'd wear it all day long without it stopping), it would just stop quite quickly after I took it off for the day--that doesn't seem like a broken mainspring does it?

as to QC--you're unfortunately quite correct.

I had a similar issue with a new Ti 44. After service it was running fine though.

[mbalmz]

Originally Posted by GB-man

I had a similar issue with a new Ti 44. After service it was running fine though.

good to know--thanks!

[imperio]

Originally Posted by PJ S

Complete and utter bollocks!

Your mainspring broke, more than likely.



As for their comprehensive camera system – must be crap resolution if they can’t see what the eye of the person inspecting the watch should’ve seen and noted.

Given they haven’t, then it’s safe to assume they marked the bezel, and whomever has been speaking with you is making it out that they’re doing you a favour… along with the veiled insinuation that you are claiming for something you did yourself!

Doesn’t exactly give you a lot of faith in their QC routine, does it?

Completely agree on the QC front.

[karasus]

Originally Posted by mbalmz

good to know--thanks!

Seems like a Dubois Depraz Chronograph Module issue. ROO is essentially two movement's in one, a base and a module which runs the chronograph plus all the subdials including seconds.

When they work, they are perfect. When things fuck up they go really bad. Most likely something was wrong in the module that is made by Dubois Depraz and AP missed it in the quality control.

[ROA]

Originally Posted by Gravity

Given the two issues I'd press for new watch at this point. You are absolutely not out of line for not accepting subpar performance or damage from AP. Keep us posted.

I agree with this. You paid for a brand new watch. Not a repaired one.

[Tomas Eriksson]

Originally Posted by pinoy

I agree with this. You paid for a brand new watch. Not a repaired one.

The watch is however hardly brand new after a couple of months. Im assuming the watch have a bunch of swirls from it's daily use and therefore I don't think it's in the right of the customer to expect a brand new replacement on used piece.

[Cevan]

I had a similar issue, they also told me premature drying of the oils on a 7 month old watch... it worked fine after service, however I had to send it right back because the Chrono was not working properly.
I learned that QC process is only on the primary timekeeping function of the watch, therefore after the second time I sent it back I was told they were keeping it for a 2 week QC check, 1 week for the timekeeping and 1 week to throughly test Chrono complication.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Trailboss516]

Same reason why I sold my AP. Bought new from boutique.
Went in broken, came back and literally a day later a separate quality control issue on their side caused it to go back in.

Once back again, a third issue a few months later.

Enough and goodbye.

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by karasus

Seems like a Dubois Depraz Chronograph Module issue. ROO is essentially two movement's in one, a base and a module which runs the chronograph plus all the subdials including seconds.

When they work, they are perfect. When things fuck up they go really bad. Most likely something was wrong in the module that is made by Dubois Depraz and AP missed it in the quality control.

Not a chance – it’s an engineering issue which AP has never properly paid attention to in order to resolve.
DD is hugely respected in the industry, and make so many modules (including ACs and PCs) for others which sit on mundane ETA bases or the customer’s own, that if their quality was woeful, we’d be seeing numerous reports about watches, costing much less than a Rolex, having issues of a similar nature.
The blame lies solely with AP in this regard, but they’ll never admit it!

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by mbalmz

well the watch would still get going via the crown after it stopped, and it still wound automatically as I wore it (i.e. I'd wear it all day long without it stopping), it would just stop quite quickly after I took it off for the day--that doesn't seem like a broken mainspring does it?

as to QC--you're unfortunately quite correct.

Depends on how active you were whilst wearing it, and depends whereabouts along the spring that it failed.
Modern synthetic oils simply don’t dry up prematurely, and it can’t be increased friction alone which caused the watch to stop, especially in light of the fact it ran fine whilst there was some winding input.
Nonetheless, and since your contract is with the AD it was purchased from, it’d be them who you’d need to discuss the option of returning for a replacement. Check where you stand regarding your consumer rights, in case the dealer tries to tell you that your only option is a warranty repair.

[mbalmz]

Originally Posted by PJ S

Depends on how active you were whilst wearing it, and depends whereabouts along the spring that it failed.

Modern synthetic oils simply don’t dry up prematurely, and it can’t be increased friction alone which caused the watch to stop, especially in light of the fact it ran fine whilst there was some winding input.

Nonetheless, and since your contract is with the AD it was purchased from, it’d be them who you’d need to discuss the option of returning for a replacement. Check where you stand regarding your consumer rights, in case the dealer tries to tell you that your only option is a warranty repair.

well it was AP that already serviced the movement under warranty, and AP that eff’d up the bezel while they were servicing the movement—not the AD—so I think I’m past that now.

[Burlington]

Originally Posted by mbalmz

makes sense--assuming they fix this thing to my satisfaction (lord knows it will be a bigger issue if there's something new wrong with it), any thought/idea as to what a gesture of goodwill would be in this situation?

Realistically something like the brown leather travel case, cap etc.

[Burlington]

Originally Posted by PJ S

Complete and utter bollocks!

Your mainspring broke, more than likely.



As for their comprehensive camera system – must be crap resolution if they can’t see what the eye of the person inspecting the watch should’ve seen and noted.

Given they haven’t, then it’s safe to assume they marked the bezel, and whomever has been speaking with you is making it out that they’re doing you a favour… along with the veiled insinuation that you are claiming for something you did yourself!

Doesn’t exactly give you a lot of faith in their QC routine, does it?

Not sure on the specific resolution but it looked very high quality on the HD viewing screen.

It’s possible with the right placement of the scuff on the bezel and reflections in the light box however that it may be inconclusive upon review. Nevertheless they are making it right for the OP and I’m sure it will be back on his wrist much faster than most other brands could manage.

[pkrussel]

I think you have all the grounds to be upset and request a refund or new watch. I can’t imagine paying that much for a watch that was defective, no way.

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by mbalmz

well it was AP that already serviced the movement under warranty, and AP that eff’d up the bezel while they were servicing the movement—not the AD—so I think I’m past that now.

Under consumer law, anywhere in the world, your contract will always be with the reseller, not the manufacturer.
It doesn’t matter that AP have serviced it under warranty, and marked the bezel – if you state laws permit a return of goods for replacement or refund, then that’s what you’re entitled to ask for.
It’s none of your concern who’s left holding the watch, but you can rest assured that it’ll be AP, not your AD, so you don’t have to feel guilty about ask what the law says you can – and that assumes you’ll even have to cite the law to the AD.
If they’re a decent sort, they’ll know it’s part and parcel of the territory that goes with being in the retail trade.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by mbalmz

and after picking up the watch I notice there's a mark on the bezel that wasn't there before. not a scratch or a dent really, but an opaque "scuff-like" mark on the polished bit of the bezel that looks like a smudge you'll just be able to wipe off (but can't).

they do take hi res photos of everything when it goes in. At least thats what they told me as well

Did they share them with you? no idea if they do

[mbalmz]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

they do take hi res photos of everything when it goes in. At least thats what they told me as well

Did they share them with you? no idea if they do

they did not share them with me. when they first told me they “couldn’t tell” from the photos I was going to ask to see them, but once they told me they were still going to take the watch in to fix the bezel I felt like it wasn’t worth it (maybe I still should have).

[Gravity]

Originally Posted by Tomas Eriksson

The watch is however hardly brand new after a couple of months. Im assuming the watch have a bunch of swirls from it's daily use and therefore I don't think it's in the right of the customer to expect a brand new replacement on used piece.

A few months old watch is still "new" in any reasonable mind, but really depends on the amount of use / wear. From the sound of things it seems the only way to put the OP at ease is for a replacement. Now not only are the internals being played with but now the finish is as well. It's definitely not a "new" watch now and why I would press for a replacement or refund. I highly doubt they would refund you and send a very unhappy customer back out into the world to spread the word.

[mbalmz]

Originally Posted by Gravity

A few months old watch is still "new" in any reasonable mind, but really depends on the amount of use / wear. From the sound of things it seems the only way to put the OP at ease is for a replacement. Now not only are the internals being played with but now the finish is as well. It's definitely not a "new" watch now and why I would press for a replacement or refund. I highly doubt they would refund you and send a very unhappy customer back out into the world to spread the word.

to put the age of the watch in context, it was a gift from my fiancee and because it was supposed to be a gift for a specific date but she knew it was a generally hard to get hold of watch, she bought it right away when she found it at the AD but only gave it to me a few months after that; so when I originally gave AP the watch to service, it had only been out of the box/plastic and worn for ~3.5 months (with barely any wear--only a few very, very faint swirls), but it had actually been purchased more like 6-7 months prior. based on that amount of time and my initial thought that it must be an easy fix I hadn't really considered pushing for a replacement at all. at this point I feel like I need to wait until they're done working on it the second time and go from there but we'll see... obviously kind of frustrating.

[Rrpdc]

Typical AP service. Not surprised