16610 - does this look right?

[seabass23]

An acquaintance just bought this watch and sent me this photo. He bought the watch from a close friend who he trusts. The seller claims to be the original owner. He says that he got the full kit including the original bill of sale.

The quality of the photo is poor but I had immediate concerns with the date window. The magnification looks wrong and it is also scuffed (does sapphire scuff like that?). He also mentioned that "chrome is flaking off the crown"! These were big red flags for me. As well, it looks quite over-polished.

I know his next step should be to get it authenticated but I just wanted some opinions from the forum. I don't want to panic him for no reason.

[importstunna]

That is not authentic. Bracelet is incorrect, case shape is off, date magnifier is off. Need better pics for dial, hands, bezel to conclude if it's a frankenwatch. Sorry to say this, but your friend was robbed.

[seabass23]

Originally Posted by importstunna

That is not authentic. Bracelet is incorrect, case shape is off, date magnifier is off. Need better pics for dial, hands, bezel to conclude if it's a frankenwatch. Sorry to say this, but your friend was robbed.

Yeah. I was pretty sure something was wrong. Thanks.

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[GGGMT]

Fuzzy fuzzy picture. Still looks bad.


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[antrolexsub]

Terrible picture but I think it’s possibly genuine, just badly polished and with an aftermarket crystal. The bezel insert is real. Can you get any clearer pictures? Close up of the dial, side view crown side, back and inner clasp would help.

[Peemaster]

Wow, why do so many people who collect expensive watches seem to only have digital cameras from the mid 90s?

Even with this poor quality i see many red flags which mostly already have been addressed:

- seemingly low date magnification (this can happen with some 16610s though.
- shiny bracelet
- overpolished horns / case

So what did your buddy pay for this one?

[seabass23]

Here's the whole story for those that have time.

This isn't a friend. This is a person that contacted me regarding an Omega that I advertised for sale locally. I was a bit slow returning his call, and in the meantime he somehow tracked down an old co-worker who he knew owned a Submariner. He asked if it was for sale and it was. When he and I finally connected over the phone, he told me he was going to look at this Submariner.

We ended up talking watches for quite a while. He's a nice guy but clearly had done no research. I gave him some basic advice regarding market price on 5-digit Subs. I also told him that if he was going to look at the Sub, I wouldn't mind if he texted me a photo prior to doing the transaction. I don't want anyone to buy a bad watch if I can help it!

He texted me that photo AFTER he bought it. He paid the equivalent of about $5k USD.

When I saw the photo, I immediately called him and raised concerns. The date window was the first flag, the case shape and bracelet were the second. The third flag was when he told me that some chrome was flaking off the crown!

He received the box, papers, anchor, original receipt (from a local AD), and service papers from a local watchmaker. Based on all this and his 30-year relationship with the seller, he's convinced that it IS real. He was quick to dismiss my concerns.

Maybe it's a fake watch in a real box, or it's horribly over-polished and serviced with cheap aftermarket parts. It's a bad buy nonetheless. He is still interested in my Omega so I may get to meet him and see this watch first hand. I'll report back.

[tigey]

real but in bad condition, polished and aftermarket Xtal

[seabass23]

Originally Posted by tigey

real but in bad condition, polished and aftermarket Xtal

It's got to be an aftermarket crown as well. Am I wrong in assuming that the crown should NOT have a chrome plating? I expect it should be all stainless.

[214270Explorer]

Flaking crown? Could be a fake watch.

And sometimes photos are deliberately bad in an attempt to hide the flaws.

You should think a LOT more about this watch.

[Bigblu10]

The image is horrible. Anything flaking off the crown is a big red flag. Need more, clearer images to determine authenticity.

[subtona]

It does not look right.

[jvmartin]

It may be genuine, however, the case is polished down to a nub... looks like it was high polished with a high polished center link and they sure went to town on it...

[RobotDoctor]

Doesn't Rolex place the pearl centered on the triangle with the edges of the pearl on the edge of the triangle mark, not extending over it or in some cases off center? To me the date magnification, pearl location and band would raise flags to me.

[Handey0465]

I bet serial doesn’t match paperwork

[77T]

Originally Posted by seabass23

This isn't a friend. This is a person that contacted me regarding an Omega that I advertised for sale locally.
-snip-
... He was quick to dismiss my concerns.

Maybe it's a fake watch in a real box, or it's horribly over-polished and serviced with cheap aftermarket parts. It's a bad buy nonetheless. He is still interested in my Omega so I may get to meet him and see this watch first hand. I'll report back.

I would not bother even a jot.

IMHO, the pic he sent is purposely fuzzy. Also doubt his whole story - and his quick dismissal is a red flag.

Look for a better buyer for your Omega.


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[seabass23]

Just a quick update. I met with the owner of the Rolex and sold him my Omega.

He did not bring along the Sub so I was not able to see it first hand. We did discuss it though. He clearly did some more research and was second-guessing his purchase. I politely suggested that he attempt to get his money back. I also provided him the name of my preferred watchmaker and STRONGLY suggested that he have it inspected as soon as possible. I asked him to provide me more photos, but he declined. I suspect it's because he's afraid of what the photos might show.

I genuinely feel bad for him. He's new to the hobby and made a bad buy. I tried to help him but it was too late. At least his new Omega is 100% authentic!

[58junior]

What is the going price for a full kit 80’s sub ?

[michael067]

Run

[Knappo 1307]

Originally Posted by michael067

Run

You have been busy today, you bumped up 26 threads in the watchout section with absolutely zero input. Well done!!!!!

[seabass23]

UPDATE TIME - IT'S REAL!

Today, I reached out the owner of the watch in question. I still had our saved text conversation so I thought I'd check in with him. We texted back and forth a bit and then he called me. I asked him for an update on his 16610.

He took it straight to the watchmaker that I recommended. It's currently being overhauled with a new crown and crystal (correct parts). The cost of the service is over twice what I typically pay, indicative that a number of incorrect parts need to be replaced.

We talked for quite a while. Great guy and definitely not a scammer. We get along well and hopefully I'll get the opportunity to see this watch. Hopefully, it looks better in person than in the original photo!

[tvandevelde]

Originally Posted by seabass23

UPDATE TIME - IT'S REAL!

Today, I reached out the owner of the watch in question. I still had our saved text conversation so I thought I'd check in with him. We texted back and forth a bit and then he called me. I asked him for an update on his 16610.

He took it straight to the watchmaker that I recommended. It's currently being overhauled with a new crown and crystal (correct parts). The cost of the service is over twice what I typically pay, indicative that a number of incorrect parts need to be replaced.

We talked for quite a while. Great guy and definitely not a scammer. We get along well and hopefully I'll get the opportunity to see this watch. Hopefully, it looks better in person than in the original photo!

Good job looking out! Great way to make connections too (and an Omega sale)! I get inquiries from people I've sold to, but haven't spoken to in forever. Always happy to lend a hand and quick to admit when it's out of my wheelhouse.

[GGGMT]

Originally Posted by seabass23

UPDATE TIME - IT'S REAL!

Today, I reached out the owner of the watch in question. I still had our saved text conversation so I thought I'd check in with him. We texted back and forth a bit and then he called me. I asked him for an update on his 16610.

He took it straight to the watchmaker that I recommended. It's currently being overhauled with a new crown and crystal (correct parts). The cost of the service is over twice what I typically pay, indicative that a number of incorrect parts need to be replaced.

We talked for quite a while. Great guy and definitely not a scammer. We get along well and hopefully I'll get the opportunity to see this watch. Hopefully, it looks better in person than in the original photo!

Great update! I will say you have more interest in a stranger than I would have.


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