Bad News for Aliens???

[Blansky]

The Odds That Aliens Exist Just Got Worse....

Dammit, you mean my alien abduction was just a dream???


https://nautil.us/the-odds-that-alie...-worse-716615/

[EEpro]

Is it better to be lonely or have aliens terraforming Uranus ?

[AzPaul]

I don't mean to throw shade on Stern and Gerya, as they're obviously qualified researchers, but over the years I've watched a good deal of science fiction TV shows and movies, and trust me, there is no shortage of alien civilizations and inhabitable planets. They're damn near everywhere. With the best news being, alien chicks tend to be quite hot and very often, scantily clad.

[Krash]

The odds that intelligent aliens exist in our galactic neighborhood aren’t that good. Let’s assume within 10,000 light years, which is 10% the size of our Milky Way Galaxy, and contains over 3 billion stars. I’d venture to say we might be alone within that distance. For perspective, this would be the range of a star ship assuming it can travel at 10,000 times the speed of light. (LOL, never going to happen, not in a million years will we have that ability).

But considering that the galaxy is 100,000 light years in length, and there are trillions of other galaxies in the universe, each with billions of stars, then I’d say it’s a given that other alien races exist.

The problem for these aliens is that they are bound to the same universal laws of physics that we are. Even if they had the ability to propel through the universe at a million times the speed of light (which is a big if), they are still likely too far away to visit us. And we have no way of knowing if they exist or not.


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[Maleg]

Originally Posted by Blansky

The Odds That Aliens Exist Just Got Worse....

Dammit, you mean my alien abduction was just a dream???


https://nautil.us/the-odds-that-alie...-worse-716615/

What did they look like? If they were hot babes in fur bikini’s they were probably real.

Originally Posted by Krash

The odds that intelligent aliens exist in our galactic neighborhood aren’t that good. Let’s assume within 10,000 light years, which is 10% the size of our Milky Way Galaxy, and contains over 3 billion stars. I’d venture to say we might be alone within that distance. For perspective, this would be the range of a star ship assuming it can travel at 10,000 times the speed of light.

But considering that the galaxy is 100,000 light years in length, and there are trillions of other galaxies in the universe, each with billions of stars, then I’d say it’s a given that other alien races exist.

The problem for these aliens is that they are bound to the same universal laws of physics that we are. Even if they had the ability to propel through the universe at a million times the speed of light (which is a big if), they are likely too far away to visit us. And we have no way of knowing if they exist or not.


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The Starship Enterprise only went 729 times the speed of light and they ran into alien species all over the place.

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

I don't mean to throw shade on Stern and Gerya, as they're obviously qualified researchers, but over the years I've watched a good deal of science fiction TV shows and movies, and trust me, there is no shortage of alien civilizations and inhabitable planets. They're damn near everywhere. With the best news being, alien chicks tend to be quite hot and very often, scantily clad.

I saw a lot of that too.

But now I'm starting to question if we weren't watching documentaries at all, but instead Roger Corman fantasy stuff.

Which would be disappointing.

[BraveBold]

Unanswerable with any degree of accuracy and wild shifts in assumptions and estimates over short periods of time reflect as much. Why? Because people have a limited capacity to understand the universe. Hell, even highly intelligent people (and I have a higher bar than most) barely understand fundamental things on Earth.

My opinion (aside the above) is you have vast numbers at play. Vast distances, vast time frames. If an intelligent being developed and reached our general level of intelligence millions of years prior to humans, it is entirely plausible they can transverse galaxies in ways that completely obliterate our understanding of physics. Equally plausible is that no such intelligent being developed outside of Earth, or that they developed at a slower or more delayed pace than us. Also plausible that a being (or beings) exist that lack what we’d recognize as high general intelligence but have a different enough composition to naturally traverse space or dimensions, or that interact with time in a different way.

With all the possibilities (based on numbers and our limitations) we cannot even be certain on the basis of outcomes. We may not be able to perceive certain technology or beings - and so again cannot know with certainty that a lack of apparent evidence is definitive.

So in summary, we don’t know much and couldn’t state with much real certainty what is or is not out there. Speculation on existence is extremely limited even based on our conventional scientific approaches. Speculation on anything visiting us is far more assessable by current science and perhaps we are comfortable enough to say nothing is visiting us… and the rest gets into the realm of philosophy.

Still waiting for scientists (or doctors, nutritionists, someone) to decide if wine and coffee in moderation are healthy or not.

[Krash]

Originally Posted by Krash

The odds that intelligent aliens exist in our galactic neighborhood aren’t that good. Let’s assume within 10,000 light years, which is 10% the size of our Milky Way Galaxy, and contains over 3 billion stars. I’d venture to say we might be alone within that distance. For perspective, this would be the range of a star ship assuming it can travel at 10,000 times the speed of light. (LOL, never going to happen, not in a million years will we have that ability).

But considering that the galaxy is 100,000 light years in length, and there are trillions of other galaxies in the universe, each with billions of stars, then I’d say it’s a given that other alien races exist.

The problem for these aliens is that they are bound to the same universal laws of physics that we are. Even if they had the ability to propel through the universe at a million times the speed of light (which is a big if), they are still likely too far away to visit us. And we have no way of knowing if they exist or not.


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One other thing…

When it comes to speed of light travel, there is one big barrier for us and the aliens to overcome.

Assuming that we could travel faster than light, then theoretically, we could arrive at our destination before we left. That’s a problem without a solution.


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[Maleg]

Originally Posted by Krash

One other thing…

When it comes to speed of light travel, there is one big barrier for us and the aliens to overcome.

Assuming that we could travel faster than light, then theoretically, we could arrive at our destination before we left. That’s a problem without a solution.


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Time would slow faster than light speed, but you can’t go back in time no matter how fast you go. Consider it asymptotic.

We would fold space-time to exceed light speed. Our actual speed isn’t that fast, but traversing the folds gets us places faster than light travels. Warp theory is real.

[BraveBold]

Originally Posted by Maleg

Time would slow faster than light speed, but you can’t go back in time no matter how fast you go. Consider it asymptotic.

We would fold space-time to exceed light speed. Our actual speed isn’t that fast, but traversing the folds gets us places faster than light travels. Warp theory is real.

Yes, within the realm of the theoretical the limitation is on the speed along the space-time “curve”…not necessarily speed as we consider measuring time to travel between two points (origin and destination). Imagine a case where you have two choices, walking around a long barrier to reach a destination that (excluding the barrier) is actually within arm’s reach. Einstein’s special theory covers the “walking around” maximum speed. It doesn’t preclude the alternative of getting “through” the barrier. In many ways, he introduced some of the alternatives that suggest the alternative is possible.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Maleg

Time would slow faster than light speed, but you can’t go back in time no matter how fast you go. Consider it asymptotic.

We would fold space-time to exceed light speed. Our actual speed isn’t that fast, but traversing the folds gets us places faster than light travels. Warp theory is real.

Alright …. How do I set my watch to this?

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by brandrea

Alright …. How do I set my watch to this?

Just set it from your phone like you do now. Duh.

But don't buy a perpetual calendar. That'll be a bitch.

[Krash]

Originally Posted by BraveBold

Yes, within the realm of the theoretical the limitation is on the speed along the space-time “curve”…not necessarily speed as we consider measuring time to travel between two points (origin and destination). Imagine a case where you have two choices, walking around a long barrier to reach a destination that (excluding the barrier) is actually within arm’s reach. Einstein’s special theory covers the “walking around” maximum speed. It doesn’t preclude the alternative of getting “through” the barrier. In many ways, he introduced some of the alternatives that suggest the alternative is possible.

Yes, Einstein’s theory of relativity allows for warp drive capability. But to me, the ability to fold space-time, to get us to a point say 10,000 light years way, seems even more fetched to me than some sort of anti-gravity, brute strength method to get us there. And this comes from a huge Star Trek fan.

This debate is fun and entertaining.


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[Easy E]

Originally Posted by EEpro

Is it better to be lonely or have aliens terraforming Uranus ?

Lonely, has to be

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by Easy E

Lonely

Exactly. Let's not overthink this.

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by BraveBold

Yes, within the realm of the theoretical the limitation is on the speed along the space-time “curve”…not necessarily speed as we consider measuring time to travel between two points (origin and destination). Imagine a case where you have two choices, walking around a long barrier to reach a destination that (excluding the barrier) is actually within arm’s reach. Einstein’s special theory covers the “walking around” maximum speed. It doesn’t preclude the alternative of getting “through” the barrier. In many ways, he introduced some of the alternatives that suggest the alternative is possible.

You’re referring to the barn-pole paradox? If you have a 30 foot pole and a 20 foot barn, if the pole is moving fast enough from the barns perspective the pole will be length contracted and thus fit in the barn. This was a question on the final exam of my Special Relativity course some 60 years ago.

[ltmgeller]

Originally Posted by EEpro

Is it better to be lonely or have aliens terraforming Uranus ?

[enjoythemusic]

If aliens come and take me away, I'll consider it a Rescue Mission.

[dtwer]

Originally Posted by Krash

The odds that intelligent aliens exist in our galactic neighborhood aren’t that good. Let’s assume within 10,000 light years, which is 10% the size of our Milky Way Galaxy, and contains over 3 billion stars. I’d venture to say we might be alone within that distance. For perspective, this would be the range of a star ship assuming it can travel at 10,000 times the speed of light. (LOL, never going to happen, not in a million years will we have that ability).

But considering that the galaxy is 100,000 light years in length, and there are trillions of other galaxies in the universe, each with billions of stars, then I’d say it’s a given that other alien races exist.

The problem for these aliens is that they are bound to the same universal laws of physics that we are. Even if they had the ability to propel through the universe at a million times the speed of light (which is a big if), they are still likely too far away to visit us. And we have no way of knowing if they exist or not.


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This. And don't forget the time factor. Assuming the Big Bang theory holds, it puts the age of the universe at, conservatively, 13.8 billion years. Within that span of time, any civilizations advanced enough to venture out of their home planet would have come and gone. The odds of any that coincides with our existence is exceedingly small.

[Barbara_C]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3c55VB_wvNA

some bad language

[Krash]

Here is a good video describing faster-than-light time paradoxes. (i.e., arriving at your destination before your leave.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbbZe8f5HQc