Opinion on this 5513?

[Tubeguy]

It appears to me this 1971 5513 is original. Maybe the bezel isn't. Do you see anything suspect?

Thanks to you that answer. Really appreciated. I'd like a 5512 w/ box and papers, but man...

[Dan S]

The main condition issue I'm seeing is the case.

[Tubeguy]

Originally Posted by Dan S

The main condition issue I'm seeing is the case.

You're right. A couple of the lugs are very thin. Is that what you speak of Dan?

Thank you

[Dan S]

Yes, and the lug holes look a bit cratered and the crown guards shape has been modified a bit. Just overall, not a great case. But it's a matter of what your priorities are and price.

[springer]

And, the bezel insert is artificially aged and the pearl doesn't appear to be correct.

[502 to Right]

A question for the experts here: of all the 5513's for sale, how many have acceptable lugs to you out of 10?

For example 4 of 10? 2 of 10?

It seems like very few can pass the lug test. But maybe I'm wrong.

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by 502 to Right

A question for the experts here: of all the 5513's for sale, how many have acceptable lugs to you out of 10?

For example 4 of 10? 2 of 10?

It seems like very few can pass the lug test. But maybe I'm wrong.

I don't know specifically lugs for 5513s. But I collect a variety of brands of vintage watches and scan through many listings every day. I would say that I probably skip over the vast majority of listings very quickly, at least 90%-95%, because the overall condition does not interest me. It should not be surprising that only a small minority of watches have survived 50+ years in a condition that is acceptable to collectors. We are hunting down that small fraction.

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by 502 to Right

A question for the experts here: of all the 5513's for sale, how many have acceptable lugs to you out of 10?

For example 4 of 10? 2 of 10?

It seems like very few can pass the lug test. But maybe I'm wrong.

More like 0.05

[502 to Right]

Originally Posted by Dan S

I don't know specifically lugs for 5513s. But I collect a variety of brands of vintage watches and scan through many listings every day. I would say that I probably skip over the vast majority of listings very quickly, at least 90%-95%, because the overall condition does not interest me. It should not be surprising that only a small minority of watches have survived 50+ years in a condition that is acceptable to collectors. We are hunting down that small fraction.

Interesting. I was listening to Eric Wind's most recent podcast and he noted the trend going forward is a substantially greater price disparity for vintage watches based on condition. Prime examples always commanded a premium but going forward it's going to be an even greater price disparity of premium vs. average examples.

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by 502 to Right

Interesting. I was listening to Eric Wind's most recent podcast and he noted the trend going forward is a substantially greater price disparity for vintage watches based on condition. Prime examples always commanded a premium but going forward it's going to be an even greater price disparity of premium vs. average examples.

He is so ubiquitous and yet so tiresome, IMO. Despite unfollowing him months ago, I can't seem to get him out of my IG feed. I think I need to find all of his friends and unfollow them also.

The huge price disparity for excellent watches has been a fact for a long time, that's nothing new. What's a large premium? What's a greater premium? Come on. But one thing is for sure, if he is promoting this old news, you can bet that it's self-serving, since he claims that every watch passing through his hands is unpolished, even when it's clearly not. :vomit:

[springer]

Originally Posted by dan s

he is so ubiquitous and yet so tiresome, imo. Despite unfollowing him months ago, i can't seem to get him out of my ig feed. I think i need to find all of his friends and unfollow them also.

The huge price disparity for excellent watches has been a fact for a long time, that's nothing new. What's a large premium? What's a greater premium? Come on. But one thing is for sure, if he is promoting this old news, you can bet that it's self-serving, since he claims that every watch passing through his hands is unpolished, even when it's clearly not. :vomit:

I agree Dan. Nothing new in that windy podcast. In a nutshell, there will continue to be an escalation in pricing for fine vintage watches due to the diminishing numbers of them available for resale. Get one while you can!!!

[77T]

I didn't listen to the podcast - but the claim Dan mentioned about that guy saying that he only deals with unpolished cases caught my eye.

John mentioned doing case restorations in the Alex Bui thread last week.

Are we coming to an intersection of language arts?

Soon enough, a restored case done via laser welding, recutting, and finishing will yield a beautiful original vintage case that is nearly indistinguishable from a NOS, unpolished, vintage model that had lain in a safe 55 years ago.

Would the "unpolished" term be of any use since it is virtually new in its outer contours?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by 77T

I didn't listen to the podcast - but the claim Dan mentioned about that guy claiming he only deals with unpolished cases caught my eye.

I didn't listen to the podcast either, I'm just talking about what I see on my instagram feed. Virtually every watch from dealers is advertised as "unpolished" even when the case is beat to hell, the crown guards are deformed, or the lug holes are cratered. They just make the claim with no evidence, and if someone challenges them, they just double-down and claim that they are the expert, and they can tell when a case is unpolished. It's the usual BS.

Regarding the rest of your comment, your point is well taken. Obviously, there is a lot of concern about refinished watches being sold as unpolished, which is part of the reason for skepticism about the artificial "aging" being done after refinishing.

[502 to Right]

Originally Posted by Dan S

He is so ubiquitous and yet so tiresome, IMO. Despite unfollowing him months ago, I can't seem to get him out of my IG feed. I think I need to find all of his friends and unfollow them also.

He also announced he is putting his podcast behind a paywall going forward for $9.99 a month because he needs to be paid for his time! I thought that was a bit odd given that the podcast is basically an advertising device for his main business. So I won't be listening going forward.

I also laughed when he announced he is having a "retreat" this summer for watch enthusiasts. Invite only for people with watch collections exceeding $100,000 that are insured by Wind Vintage's insurance partner. Go big or get out.

[0nly5iv3Digits]

I strongly suspect the insert in it's entirety is A/M on this one.

[springer]

Originally Posted by 77T

I didn't listen to the podcast - but the claim Dan mentioned about that guy saying that he only deals with unpolished cases caught my eye.

John mentioned doing case restorations in the Alex Bui thread last week.

Are we coming to an intersection of language arts?

Soon enough, a restored case done via laser welding, recutting, and finishing will yield a beautiful original vintage case that is nearly indistinguishable from a NOS, unpolished, vintage model that had lain in a safe 55 years ago.

Would the "unpolished" term be of any use since it is virtually new in its outer contours?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The odds of seeing or finding a mint, NOS vintage sports model for sale is slim to none. If you are fortunate to find one, I would expect it to have all the original accessories, boxes, booklets, tags etc. Personally, I don't believe that I have seen an NOS Submariner 1680, 5513 or GMT 1675/16750 in 35 to 40 years - but, I haven't been keeping track.

There is definitely some unscrupulous shenanigans going on in the vintage community. Here is a red flag folks...if you continually see a dealer selling what he claims are unpolished watches, well, come on. Shouldn't that be a red flag collectors???

[Tubeguy]

Originally Posted by springer

The odds of seeing or finding a mint, NOS vintage sports model for sale is slim to none. If you are fortunate to find one, I would expect it to have all the original accessories, boxes, booklets, tags etc. Personally, I don't believe that I have seen an NOS Submariner 1680, 5513 or GMT 1675/16750 in 35 to 40 years - but, I haven't been keeping track.

There is definitely some unscrupulous shenanigans going on in the vintage community. Here is a red flag folks...if you continually see a dealer selling what he claims are unpolished watches, well, come on. Shouldn't that be a red flag collectors???

Sometimes my eyes just don't catch it. Like the lugs on this 5513 should have jumped out at me. I got excited because of it being a complete set and a reasonable price. I try as much as possible to get good examples. But I get ahead of myself.

Is there a primer somewhere that shows the small details that are not obvious at first glance? I would love to learn more.

I received the 1979 1665 I bought from Gray & Sons I had posted up here if anyone recalls. The bad news: It runs slow and while the hands looked 100% perfect in the pics, there is a very slight amount of corrosion.

The good news is the dial in absolutely fantastic, the case is beautiful, and the bracelet has almost zero stretch. It looks and feels new and the correct date code clasp is tight like a new watch. I wonder if they tightened it?