BIG Tudor Black Bay Bronze problem

[bradyb]

Looks like everyone did a great job of summing up the issue. The case looks as it should so they apparently got the material mix right (a few other mfrs messed this up). So now they just need to update the material of the bezel insert to ceramic. No big deal.

So I think it's safe to assume that this is not safe.

[Bigblu10]

Originally Posted by Largoshark

C'mon guys...this was obviously intentional. Tudor wanted to go the extra mile in giving it that very worn-in, patinaed look.

In all seriousness though, this is pretty inexcusable and should be addressed ASAP.

I would not buy one at any price point. The watch looks like it is self destructing.

[Tridor]

Thanks for this thread. I've been debating between a BB Bronze and a Pelagos Blue Titanium. Given the corrosion issue, I think I'll pass on the Bronze and focus on the Pelagos.

[kevin2779]

My BBB does not have this problem, however, it never exposed with salt-water..

[Etschell]

So i researched the bronze. It is 4 to 14 percent aluminum. Bronze is more corrosion resistant. As to the insert we know what it is. I doubt if it were steel with pvd there would be the same issue. Just look at the caseback.

[rushca01]

Very interesting, surprised these issues didn't surface during the R&D. I just purchased a Pelagos Blue and I hope I don't have buyers remorse..

[amh]

Originally Posted by rushca01

Very interesting, surprised these issues didn't surface during the R&D. I just purchased a Pelagos Blue and I hope I don't have buyers remorse..

No problems there. I wear mine in the ocean almost every weekend.

[johnnyjazz]

Originally Posted by Etschell

ever seen the panerai 382?

Does not have an insert.

[Quicksilver]

Originally Posted by unknown

I hope you don't mind I just post a link this time



Most of you know that site too :-)





http://www.watchprosite.com/rolex/so...936.8966566/0/

You think you've got problems





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[willski]

Originally Posted by bradyb

Looks like everyone did a great job of summing up the issue. The case looks as it should so they apparently got the material mix right (a few other mfrs messed this up). So now they just need to update the material of the bezel insert to ceramic. No big deal.

So I think it's safe to assume that this is not safe.

Solution is simple, execution and cost will be the big sticking issue. It will be interesting to see if Tudor acknowledge this issue and if so, what remedial steps they take.


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[luvan12]

I hope Tudor fixes it.

[unknown]

Originally Posted by Quicksilver

You think you've got problems

Attachment 887565



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That messed up panerai is done on purpose
Normally it gets a beautiful patina

The Tudor problem is something else

I really don't like it that I had to replace the inlay 4 times
Every time the watch is gone for several weeks

They should discontinue it and make a new one without the inlay

[Quicksilver]

Originally Posted by unknown

That messed up panerai is done on purpose
Normally it gets a beautiful patina

The Tudor problem is something else

I really don't like it that I had to replace the inlay 4 times
Every time the watch is gone for several weeks

They should discontinue it and make a new one without the inlay

I know it was done on purpose. It was posted tongue in cheek

To be honest as a bronze Black Bay owner I'm concerned about this issue.

[Fleetlord]

Combine this with the 23mm lugs and this reference is a big PASS for me.

[tufty]

doesn't sound/ look good, I've only worn mine about 4-5 times,

[Travelller]

Originally Posted by unknown

...I really don't like it that I had to replace the inlay 4 times ... Every time the watch is gone for several weeks...

I'm shocked by the whole topic and thought about my own bezel when I went to clean the case, deciding to use nothing more "reactive" than lemon juice (and soda water)... .

But after the third inlay I would think one would give up on the watch as a diver and use it only in the office and/or sell it...

[bdex75]

There has been this spidey sense that has come over me every time I got close to buying this model. As most are probably aware I have no problem pulling the trigger on buying a Tudor. This one (and a few others) has always just not sat right with me for some reason. I like the look, but this issue came up early, as did the issue with a lack of "patina" even when some were forcing it with sulphur and other means.

Went the Oris Carl Brashear route instead and have been very happy.

[meganfox17]

Originally Posted by bdex75

There has been this spidey sense that has come over me every time I got close to buying this model. As most are probably aware I have no problem pulling the trigger on buying a Tudor. This one (and a few others) has always just not sat right with me for some reason. I like the look, but this issue came up early, as did the issue with a lack of "patina" even when some were forcing it with sulphur and other means.

Went the Oris Carl Brashear route instead and have been very happy.

I wish I had a wee bit Spidey Sense when choosing watchesAnyways, Oris made a gamble that their time tested bronze bezel clock (Oris opted for Bronze instead of Al for the bezel ) will age in a completely different way and achieve a more consistent patinaThis is an Oris Carl Brashear watch that has been subjected to extreme or forced patinization by a method known as Apple Cider Vinegar fuming or "Vinegar sauna bath!" Notice that Galvanic Corrosions is a Non Issue here. So which bronze watch deserves the "Bronze Medal" and which 0ne deserves the "Gold Medal ?" You tell me.....

[bdex75]

Originally Posted by meganfox17

I wish I had a wee bit Spidey Sense when choosing watchesAnyways, Oris made a gamble that their time tested bronze bezel clock (Oris opted for Bronze instead of Al for the bezel ) will age in a completely different way and achieve a more consistent patinaThis is an Oris Carl Brashear watch that has been subjected to extreme or forced patinization by a method known as Apple Cider Vinegar fuming or "Vinegar sauna bath!" Notice that Galvanic Corrosions is a Non Issue here. So which bronze watch deserves the "Bronze Medal" and which 0ne deserves the "Gold Medal ?" You tell me.....

Mine is au natural.


Also had an Archimede that I flipped that had a aluminum bezel insert that was fine. Cannot figure out how this happened with Tudor.



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[G'ed]

Science to be blamed here.

Who’s the material engineer at Tudor?

That photo of half destroyed bezel is nasty.

[meganfox17]

Originally Posted by bdex75

Also had an Archimede that I flipped that had a aluminum bezel insert that was fine. Cannot figure out how this happened with Tudor

I'm guessing it has something to do with Tudor's nickel percentage in its Bronze Alluminium alloy secret formula. If you look back at the graph of the potential galvanic corrosions with metals, check out the behaviour of nickel. Any bronze watch with a typical composition of Nickel-Aluminium-Bronze alloy will not easily undergo Galvanic Corrosions in regular marine environment exposure. By adding nickel, it reduces the oxidation potential difference between the Al bezel acting as anode and the bronze alloy acting as cathode thus minimizing galvanic corrosions. I suspect the Tudor bronze Alluminium alloy has little or absent nickel content

[bdex75]

Originally Posted by meganfox17

I'm guessing it has something to do with Tudor's nickel percentage in its Bronze Alluminium alloy secret formula. If you look back at the graph of the potential galvanic corrosions with metals, check out the behaviour of nickel. Any bronze watch with a typical composition of Nickel-Aluminium-Bronze alloy will not easily undergo Galvanic Corrosions in regular marine environment exposure. By adding nickel, it reduces the oxidation potential difference between the Al bezel acting as anode and the bronze alloy acting as cathode thus minimizing galvanic corrosions. I suspect the Tudor bronze Alluminium alloy has little or absent nickel content

I agree. I remember when they launched the bronze. A big deal was made of the metallurgical makeup being different than the other bronze models CuSN8 or whatever it is. And the differences in the patina confirm that part.


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[Travelller]

I'm f*ed.


Please excuse my language but in another thread that listed almost every modern-day bronze watch, my two are the only ones (that I know of) with bezel inserts...
So no, I don't dive (anymore) but like 95% of you, I do enjoy vacation at the beach and I would certainly expect to be able to take any "dive" watch in with me...



As a (former) recreational diver, I know how important it is to rinse ALL gear with fresh water. Still, it's hard to guarantee that no salt water remains between the case and the bezel - unless you submerge the watch in fresh water for a short period of time. The average beach goer will basically "rinse off" at the local shower and his/her watch will get some fresh water, but there is little chance the owner would go as far as submerging the watch (in fresh water).

Bad news all around.

Thanks to the OP for bringing it to our attention and for those below for the very informative info. I agree with everyone who are disappointed in Tudor's R&D. I won't be using mine in salt water (having seen / understood this thread) but I also agree with everyone that mentioned a ceramic insert would resolve the issue. They could even be retrofitted for existing owners (at a hopefully nominal fee for those no longer under guarantee). I personally would have to give it some thought because you need to see this insert in person to really appreciate how beautiful it is...
(...until it gets eaten away, that is... )

Originally Posted by cangelosijeff

Follow both the inner and outer edges from 3 through 14 or so.

Originally Posted by meganfox17

That sounds like Galvanic Corrosion occuring at the contact point between 2 metals or metal alloys with salt water acting as the electrolyte medium. The holes mentioned by the OP on the bezel insert of the Tudor Bronze are actually called pits. The greater the difference in oxidation potential between the 2 metals in contact , the more serious is the Galvanic Corrosion...

Originally Posted by 77T

It appears the insert is acting as an anode in conjunction with the bronze - much like zinc is used on metal boat hulls....

Originally Posted by tomilg

It is the same reason you attach Zinc Anodes to the underside of a boat that is used or moored in a saltwater environment...because of Galvanic Corrosion, the saltwater will eat away the Zinc instead of your pricey bronze propeller(s).........In this case, instead of the Zinc being slowly eaten away, it the bezel which is acting as the sacrificial lamb.

[Danny83]

The bezel on my bronze no longer spins but It dont bother me ....ha

[77T]

IMHO, an expired warranty should not be a hinderance to Tudor doing right by owners. If I had a safety issue on a car, and it is recalled, the expired warranty is not an issue.

This is a dive watch - the bezel and insert need to be functional with normal use. I'd say the brand manager and product manager need to be thinking about this carefully...


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[VicLeChic]

Great thread about galvanic corrosion.

Don't see where the problem is, gives tons of character to your piece

By the way, "tu dors" in french means "you're sleeping". Tudor engineers, food for thought :-;

[HogwldFLTR]

Never thought this a wise choice of materials. For those who like relatively reactive watch components, great; for me, pass.

[mikkolopez]

Sympathy for those having problems with their BBB. Tudor needs to make it right to all the BBB owners whether they dive or not. I was pining for the Bucherer BB for some months now, because of this thread I am cured, no bronze BB for me.

Otoh that Bronze Pam is sick (I mean cool) and a fitting watch for Davy Jones.

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[BLNR Nairobi]

Was there any update to this issue? Did Tudor release a statement? I am (was??) considering a BBB.

[unknown]

Originally Posted by BLNR Nairobi

Was there any update to this issue? Did Tudor release a statement? I am (was??) considering a BBB.

Not yet I’m afraid
I have contact with some AD trying to get an update
But tudor still doesn’t confess they have a problem
They told my ad they are not aware of anything
But as said... mine returned already 4 times with this issue